Apparently, even Arthur needs a homosexual character

[justjess]

Well, it does change people’s thinking and they then consider evil as good, which might not seem like anything to you, but it does have consequences which is what Christian’s try to warn about.

Then simply turn off the tv Lisa. Not rocket science.

You can not force millions of people to agree with your religious views and cater to them. You can’t. If you disagree you are free to opt out for yourself and your loved ones.

 

[Faker He-Man]

Because children are impressionable and shouldn’t be brought up thinking that homosexuality is normal

On the contrary, it's the idea that uncommon somehow equals abnormal/shameful that is poisonous to impressionable children.

That reminds me... When I was around maybe 4 years old, I went to my parents crying, and they had to apologize, comfort me, calm me down, etc. Can you guess why? Hint: It wasn't after explaining that my uncle was interested in men instead of women. Nope, I was absolutely terrified, probably even mildly traumatized by my illustrated children's bible as a toddler learning to read, yet having an openly gay uncle was something I never really questioned because it didn't have an affect my life or my perception of him as a person.

 

[Lisa]

Well I read Matthew 13 and see absolutely nothing that indicates anything eternal about the weeping and gnashing of teeth.
And 2 Peter 3:9 is confirmation to me that God's mercy and grace extends beyond the short scope of this temporal life.

Well 2 Peter 3:9 was the answer to this question
Know this first of all, that in the last days mockers will come with their mocking, following after their own lusts, and saying, “Where is the promise of His coming? For ever since the fathers fell asleep, all continues just as it was from the beginning of creation.
‭‭2 PETER‬ ‭3:3-4‬ ‭

And Jesus says...
These will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.
‭‭Matthew ‭25:46‬ ‭
Doesn’t sound like a rehabilitation program to me.

 

[Lisa]

Then simply turn off the tv Lisa. Not rocket science.

You can not force millions of people to agree with your religious views and cater to them. You can’t. If you disagree you are free to opt out for yourself and your loved ones.

I’m not forcing anyone to agree with me but there will be a heavy price to be paid by those who practice iniquity.

 

[Todd]

Well 2 Peter 3:9 was the answer to this question
Know this first of all, that in the last days mockers will come with their mocking, following after their own lusts, and saying, “Where is the promise of His coming? For ever since the fathers fell asleep, all continues just as it was from the beginning of creation.
‭‭2 PETER‬ ‭3:3-4‬ ‭

Again proves my point that human perspective and God's perspective is very different. You know "one day i like a a thousand years.....

And Jesus says...
These will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.
‭‭Matthew ‭25:46‬ ‭
Doesn’t sound like a rehabilitation program to me.

Except the greek word aionios that is translated in english bibles as "eternal" doesn't actually mean "eternal". It means "of the ages" or pertaining the the ages. It's also the root of the english word "eon" which means a long but finite period of a time.

 

[Lisa]

Again proves my point that human perspective and God's perspective is very different. You know "one day i like a a thousand years.....


Except the greek word aionios that is translated in english bibles as "eternal" doesn't actually mean "eternal". It means "of the ages" or pertaining the the ages. It's also the root of the english word "eon" which means a long but finite period of a time.

It doesn’t change anything at all...God doesn’t want anyone to perish but have eternal life..so it seems like He is being slow in His punishment. Perish...not a rehabilitation program...

It’s eternal punishment Todd. God doesn’t offer a rehabilitation program in the lake of fire. His rehabilitation program begins right here..right now. Believe in the Lord Jesus Christ and be saved. You are offering a lie and its gonna cost someone dearly if they believe you.

 

[Todd]

It doesn’t change anything at all...God doesn’t want anyone to perish but have eternal life..so it seems like He is being slow in His punishment. Perish...not a rehabilitation program...

It’s eternal punishment Todd. God doesn’t offer a rehabilitation program in the lake of fire. His rehabilitation program begins right here..right now. Believe in the Lord Jesus Christ and be saved. You are offering a lie and its gonna cost someone dearly if they believe you.

Well it's ironic that you take Matthew 25 as literal confimation of your sadistic concept of eternal punishment but then don't take it literal when it comes to the idea of salvation by grace alone apart from works. The whole context of Matthew 25 is the judgement of people who think they are righteous before God. It's not a contrast between immoral God haters and Christians.

Look at verse 30...28 “‘So take the bag of gold from him and give it to the one who has ten bags. 29 For whoever has will be given more, and they will have an abundance. Whoever does not have, even what they have will be taken from them. 30 And throw that worthless servant outside, into the darkness, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.’

This is a servant of the Master who is thrown into darkness where there is weeping and gnashing of teeth. It's not an immopral person or a person who denies God. It's the person who is suppodesdly a servant of God but produces no fruit. Same as those on the left who in verse 44 as "when did we see you lord and not..." The people on the left are addressing Jesus as Lord, but still ending up where there is weeping and gnashing of teeth.

My point is @Lisa , if you want to take the parables of Matthew 25 literally you better start feeding the poor, clothing the naked and visiting those in prison, and you better have a return on the Lord's investment in you (i.e. produce fruit), or you too are going to burn in hell!

 

[Lisa]

Well it's ironic that you take Matthew 25 as literal confimation of your sadistic concept of eternal punishment but then don't take it literal when it comes to the idea of salvation by grace alone apart from works. The whole context of Matthew 25 is the judgement of people who think they are righteous before God. It's not a contrast between immoral God haters and Christians.

Look at verse 30...28 “‘So take the bag of gold from him and give it to the one who has ten bags. 29 For whoever has will be given more, and they will have an abundance. Whoever does not have, even what they have will be taken from them. 30 And throw that worthless servant outside, into the darkness, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.’

This is a servant of the Master who is thrown into darkness where there is weeping and gnashing of teeth. It's not an immopral person or a person who denies God. It's the person who is suppodesdly a servant of God but produces no fruit. Same as those on the left who in verse 44 as "when did we see you lord and not..." The people on the left are addressing Jesus as Lord, but still ending up where there is weeping and gnashing of teeth.

My point is @Lisa , if you want to take the parables of Matthew 25 literally you better start feeding the poor, clothing the naked and visiting those in prison, and you better have a return on the Lord's investment in you (i.e. produce fruit), or you too are going to burn in hell!

No the point is that there is an eternal punishment and an eternal life. There are only two choices with no middle ground.
These will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.
‭‭Matthew ‭25:46‬ ‭

 

[Todd]

No the point is that there is an eternal punishment and an eternal life. There are only two choices with no middle ground.
These will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.
‭‭Matthew ‭25:46‬ ‭

But you are making that point using a literal interpretation of a suspect translation of a parable. If you are going to be consistent then anyone who doesn't feed the poor, clothe the naked, visit those in prison or provide the lord with a return on his investment is going to hell also.

 

[justjess]

Yeah I was surprised she just bounced right over that - being the main point - as well

 

[mecca]

Well, it does change people’s thinking and they then consider evil as good, which might not seem like anything to you, but it does have consequences which is what Christian’s try to warn about.

Gay people are not evil.

 

[Lisa]

But you are making that point using a literal interpretation of a suspect translation of a parable. If you are going to be consistent then anyone who doesn't feed the poor, clothe the naked, visit those in prison or provide the lord with a return on his investment is going to hell also.

A parable that most people don’t understand because they don’t know God..you mean? Is that why people think its suspect? Anyway.. I don’t see where there is that third option you like to talk about in it. Why not say that there is eternal punishment, rehabilitation and eternal life? He didn’t say it, it doesn’t exist. People would like for it to..but that doesn’t mean it does.

 

[Todd]

Yeah I was surprised she just bounced right over that - being the main point - as well

Honestly, I'm not that surprised as that is what a good portion of mainstream Christianity is really good at doing.

 

[Todd]

A parable that most people don’t understand because they don’t know God..you mean?

No a parable that is clearly speaking about people who think they are right with God, but Jesus rejects them because they didn't have any fruit....i.e. they didn't think they needed to do any works.

Is that why people think its suspect?

I wasn't saying the parable is suspect. I was saying your english translation is suspect.

Anyway.. I don’t see where there is that third option you like to talk about in it. Why not say that there is eternal punishment, rehabilitation and eternal life? He didn’t say it, it doesn’t exist. People would like for it to..but that doesn’t mean it does.

Where are you getting three options from? I never said there was three options. There is either punishment in the age to come or abundant life in the age to come.

And yes elite controlling religious leaders would love for eternal torment to exist so they can scare the lay people into submission. Doesn't mean it really exists.

 

[justjess]

That parable is specifically telling you to care for the poor and disadvantaged... and all you focus on is eternal punishment? Did you take heart to the main point?

This is why I can’t with Christians... you are repeatedly told by your holy book and savior to be a good person and care for others like Jesus cares for you and you repeatedly ignore it in favor of “believe I’m god or burn”

Is doing what Jesus actually said to do too hard or something?

 

[Lisa]

Gay people are not evil.

All sin is evil...

 

[Todd]

Is doing what Jesus actually said to do too hard or something?

It's not that hard to do, but it is inconvenient.
It's much more convenient to carve out a couple hours Sunday morning and join a club.

 

[Lisa]

That parable is specifically telling you to care for the poor and disadvantaged... and all you focus on is eternal punishment? Did you take heart to the main point?

This is why I can’t with Christians... you are repeatedly told by your holy book and savior to be a good person and care for others like Jesus cares for you and you repeatedly ignore it in favor of “believe I’m god or burn”

Is doing what Jesus actually said to do too hard or something?

I specifically mentioned the verse to show that there are two choices, there aren’t any other choices. What’s so hard about seeing that?

Telling people why they will be thrown in the lake of fire where there is weeping and gnashing of teeth is part of the gospel. Telling people that there is a savior is the other part to that..the get out of jail free card if you will. It’s a good deal!

Edit: its a good deal and the only deal, honestly.

 

[Lisa]

It's not that hard to do, but it is inconvenient.
It's much more convenient to carve out a couple hours Sunday morning and join a club.

Ya, many Sunday mornings resemble the country club...seems to be getting worse not better too. I know a woman who talks about loving the worship service at a church I used to go to a loooonnnngggg time ago because it resembles a rock concert. My husband had been going there and wanted me to come but I hated that rock concert and stopped going and so did he...

 

[Lisa]

There is either punishment in the age to come or abundant life in the age to come.

The punishment and the life is eternal..so not just in the age to come.