Abortion - The End of the Slippery Slope

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Last edited:
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Your wrong roe v Wade allowed abortion past viability to protect the life or health of the mother. Same language.

https://caselaw.findlaw.com/us-supreme-court/410/113.html

View attachment 19328View attachment 19328
In Roe v Wade, there's a penal law for abortions after viability, except when the mother's physical health is directly threatened, that are not regulated by the State. In the NY adaption the penal law for abortion after viability has been completely repealed. In practice this means, unlike Roe v Wade, that any medical professional that is not a licensed physician cannot be penalized for performing any abortion after viability as long as it has the mother's consent.

Penal Law

HOMICIDE[, ABORTION] AND RELATED OFFENSES
5 § 6. Section 125.00 of the penal law is amended to read as follows:
6 § 125.00 Homicide defined.
7 Homicide means conduct which causes the death of a person [or an
8 unborn child with which a female has been pregnant for more than twen-
9 ty-four weeks]
under circumstances constituting murder, manslaughter in
10 the first degree, manslaughter in the second degree, or criminally
11 negligent homicide[, abortion in the first degree or self-abortion in
12 the first degree]
.
13 § 7. The section heading, opening paragraph and subdivision 1 of
14 section 125.05 of the penal law are amended to read as follows:
15 Homicide[, abortion] and related offenses; [definitions of terms]
16 definition.
17 The following [definitions are] definition is applicable to this arti-
18 cle:
19 [1.] "Person," when referring to the victim of a homicide, means a
20 human being who has been born and is alive.

...

28 (b) Any of the following felonies: assault in the second degree as
29 defined in section 120.05 of the penal law, assault in the first degree
30 as defined in section 120.10 of the penal law, reckless endangerment in
31 the first degree as defined in section 120.25 of the penal law, promot-
32 ing a suicide attempt as defined in section 120.30 of the penal law,
33 strangulation in the second degree as defined in section 121.12 of the
34 penal law, strangulation in the first degree as defined in section
35 121.13 of the penal law, criminally negligent homicide as defined in
36 section 125.10 of the penal law, manslaughter in the second degree as
37 defined in section 125.15 of the penal law, manslaughter in the first
38 degree as defined in section 125.20 of the penal law, murder in the
39 second degree as defined in section 125.25 of the penal law, murder in
40 the first degree as defined in section 125.27 of the penal law,
41 [abortion in the second degree as defined in section 125.40 of the penal
42 law, abortion in the first degree as defined in section 125.45 of the
43 penal law,] r*pe in the third degree as defined in section 130.25 of the
44 penal law, r*pe in the second degree as defined in section 130.30 of the
45 penal law, r*pe in the first degree as defined in section 130.35 of the
46 penal law, ...

...

28 1. A coroner or medical examiner has jurisdiction and authority to
29 investigate the death of every person dying within his county, or whose
30 body is found within the county, which is or appears to be:
31 (a) A violent death, whether by criminal violence, suicide or casual-
32 ty;
33 (b) A death caused by unlawful act or criminal neglect;
34 (c) A death occurring in a suspicious, unusual or unexplained manner;
35 (d) [A death caused by suspected criminal abortion;
36 (e)] A death while unattended by a physician, so far as can be discov-
37 ered, or where no physician able to certify the cause of death as
38 provided in the public health law and in form as prescribed by the
39 commissioner of health can be found;
40 [(f)] (e) A death of a person confined in a public institution other
41 than a hospital, infirmary or nursing home.
42 § 12. Section 4 of the judiciary law, as amended by chapter 264 of the
43 laws of 2003, is amended to read as follows:
44 § 4. Sittings of courts to be public. The sittings of every court
45 within this state shall be public, and every citizen may freely attend
46 the same, except that in all proceedings and trials in cases for
47 divorce, seduction, [abortion,] r*pe, assault with intent to commit
48 r*pe, criminal sexual act, bastardy or filiation, the court may, in its
49 discretion, exclude therefrom all persons who are not directly inter-
50 ested therein, excepting jurors, witnesses, and officers of the court.
 
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Joined
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Messages
3,259

justjess

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Messages
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In Roe v Wade, there's a penal law for abortions after viability, except when the mother's physical health is directly threatened, that are not regulated by the State. In the NY adaption the penal law for abortion after viability has been completely repealed. In practice this means, unlike Roe v Wade, that any medical professional that is not a licensed physician cannot be penalized for performing any abortion after viability as long as it has the mother's consent.

Penal Law

HOMICIDE[, ABORTION] AND RELATED OFFENSES
5 § 6. Section 125.00 of the penal law is amended to read as follows:
6 § 125.00 Homicide defined.
7 Homicide means conduct which causes the death of a person [or an
8 unborn child with which a female has been pregnant for more than twen-
9 ty-four weeks]
under circumstances constituting murder, manslaughter in
10 the first degree, manslaughter in the second degree, or criminally
11 negligent homicide[, abortion in the first degree or self-abortion in
12 the first degree]
.
13 § 7. The section heading, opening paragraph and subdivision 1 of
14 section 125.05 of the penal law are amended to read as follows:
15 Homicide[, abortion] and related offenses; [definitions of terms]
16 definition.
17 The following [definitions are] definition is applicable to this arti-
18 cle:
19 [1.] "Person," when referring to the victim of a homicide, means a
20 human being who has been born and is alive.

...

28 (b) Any of the following felonies: assault in the second degree as
29 defined in section 120.05 of the penal law, assault in the first degree
30 as defined in section 120.10 of the penal law, reckless endangerment in
31 the first degree as defined in section 120.25 of the penal law, promot-
32 ing a suicide attempt as defined in section 120.30 of the penal law,
33 strangulation in the second degree as defined in section 121.12 of the
34 penal law, strangulation in the first degree as defined in section
35 121.13 of the penal law, criminally negligent homicide as defined in
36 section 125.10 of the penal law, manslaughter in the second degree as
37 defined in section 125.15 of the penal law, manslaughter in the first
38 degree as defined in section 125.20 of the penal law, murder in the
39 second degree as defined in section 125.25 of the penal law, murder in
40 the first degree as defined in section 125.27 of the penal law,
41 [abortion in the second degree as defined in section 125.40 of the penal
42 law, abortion in the first degree as defined in section 125.45 of the
43 penal law,] r*pe in the third degree as defined in section 130.25 of the
44 penal law, r*pe in the second degree as defined in section 130.30 of the
45 penal law, r*pe in the first degree as defined in section 130.35 of the
46 penal law, ...

...

28 1. A coroner or medical examiner has jurisdiction and authority to
29 investigate the death of every person dying within his county, or whose
30 body is found within the county, which is or appears to be:
31 (a) A violent death, whether by criminal violence, suicide or casual-
32 ty;
33 (b) A death caused by unlawful act or criminal neglect;
34 (c) A death occurring in a suspicious, unusual or unexplained manner;
35 (d) [A death caused by suspected criminal abortion;
36 (e)] A death while unattended by a physician, so far as can be discov-
37 ered, or where no physician able to certify the cause of death as
38 provided in the public health law and in form as prescribed by the
39 commissioner of health can be found;
40 [(f)] (e) A death of a person confined in a public institution other
41 than a hospital, infirmary or nursing home.
42 § 12. Section 4 of the judiciary law, as amended by chapter 264 of the
43 laws of 2003, is amended to read as follows:
44 § 4. Sittings of courts to be public. The sittings of every court
45 within this state shall be public, and every citizen may freely attend
46 the same, except that in all proceedings and trials in cases for
47 divorce, seduction, [abortion,] r*pe, assault with intent to commit
48 r*pe, criminal sexual act, bastardy or filiation, the court may, in its
49 discretion, exclude therefrom all persons who are not directly inter-
50 ested therein, excepting jurors, witnesses, and officers of the court.
It is the same language as roe as seen in the excerpt I posted for you directly from roe. The thing is you have a problem with roe to begin with. You are also ignoring the intent of the law which is what will be used to defend it in the myriad court cases im sure are imminately coming.

The penal law you just posted is not from roe and tbh I’m not entirely sure where it’s from.

Typically homicjde laws regarding the unborn apply to people other than the mother and exclude abortion.. they are for when an outside party does harm to a fetus the parent was keeping - like murdering a woman and her unborn child.
 
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Messages
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And I could throw that back at you... it is utter hypocrisy to say you care about women while advocating for them to be viewed as nothing more than a uterus and forcing them to endure childbirth against their wishes itregardles to their own health and circumstance.

But I would never say something that retarted and short sighted, because it isn’t true. Just like it isn’t true that you can’t care about children and be pro choice. You miss a lot of nuance when you are determined to be so damn black and white about things.
How is a pregnant woman forced to endure childbirth “against her own wishes”?

She KNEW the consequences of her actions when having sex. If she was truly concerned about the reality of giving birth, she should never have spread her legs.

It really is that simple.

Say what you wish, but It IS absolute HYPOCRISY to claim you care about women’s, children or human rights while advocating to choose to murder them when they are most vulnerable & helpless. There is no way to sugarcoat it.

If you cared about or valued all human life, you would stop the insanity of playing good cop bad cop.

Their is NO gray area when it comes to butchering babies....born or unborn.

YOU have been born, nobody painfully ripped you from your mother’s womb.....why do you think YOU have the right to decide that someone else’s life should continue or end based on YOUR “choice”?

Who made YOU judge, jury & executioner of a completely INNOCENT baby who has done NOTHING wrong & is completely incapable of fighting for the life they have ALREADY begun?
 

TempestOfTempo

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Joined
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Messages
8,076
Haley Responds to Pelosi’s Climate Committee: Does Protecting God’s Creation Include Babies?


Former US ambassador to the United Nations Nikki Haley (left) and Democratic Speaker of the House Nancy Pelosi (right) (Kevin Hagen / AP Photo; J. Scott Applewhite / AP Photo)

Former U.S. Ambassador to the United Nations Nikki Haley questioned whether House Speaker Nancy Pelosi’s commitment to protecting God’s creation extended to include babies.

On Thursday, Pelosi tweeted, “We have a moral responsibility to protect God’s creation for generations to come. That is why today, we named members to the Select Committee on the Climate Crisis. #ActOnClimate.”

Haley replied, “Does God’s creation not include protecting babies as well Madame Speaker? A committee on that issue would be welcome.”
While Pelosi deserves every bit of that loaded question, Haley aint the person to deliver it. She has zero credibility in terms of advocating for the children of the world. Born or unborn.
 
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Messages
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It is the same language as roe as seen in the excerpt I posted for you directly from roe. The thing is you have a problem with roe to begin with. You are also ignoring the intent of the law which is what will be used to defend it in the myriad court cases im sure are imminately coming.

The penal law you just posted is not from roe and tbh I’m not entirely sure where it’s from.

Typically homicjde laws regarding the unborn apply to people other than the mother and exclude abortion.. they are for when an outside party does harm to a fetus the parent was keeping - like murdering a woman and her unborn child.
So it’s okay to prosecute OTHER people for harming the unborn baby, just not the mother?

How is that just?
 

TempestOfTempo

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Joined
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Messages
8,076
Artful Revealer seems to have brought up some legit points regarding the actual letter of the law. If Valerho & co. can address that honestly, can Artful Revealer in turn address his contentions regarding the Evangelical Christians abuse of the adoption process? There is ground to give on everyside..... if our pride is out of the equation and children's welfare is truly the focus.
 

justjess

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Joined
Mar 16, 2017
Messages
11,510
So it’s okay to prosecute OTHER people for harming the unborn baby, just not the mother?

How is that just?
Because this is talking about post viability, where there are strict conditions for the mother to have an abortion. Prior to that it’s considered part of the mothers body not a separate entity and you can’t criminally prosecute for it either.
 

justjess

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Joined
Mar 16, 2017
Messages
11,510
Artful Revealer seems to have brought up some legit points regarding the actual letter of the law. If Valerho & co. can address that honestly, can Artful Revealer in turn address his contentions regarding the Evangelical Christians abuse of the adoption process? There is ground to give on everyside..... if our pride is out of the equation and children's welfare is truly the focus.
I’m not sure what valid points he made since I posted directly the actual language of roe and he was wrong
 

TempestOfTempo

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Joined
Jan 29, 2018
Messages
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I’m not sure what valid points he made since I posted directly the actual language of roe and he was wrong
The two main points I thought were worth of being addressed were this remark about ratio of firearm homicide to abortion:
"Yes, I had the same rate in mind. 1,3% of a million is 13,000 a year. In the USA, less people die by firearm assaults. Are deaths of firearm assault rare?"
His contention was countered with the comment that US gun murders are closer to 15,000 but that percentage technicality didn't really address the substance of what AD posted.

Also, he offered this refutation of your legal claims regarding R v. Wade which I also thought deserved to at least be addressed:
In Roe v Wade, there's a penal law for abortions after viability, except when the mother's physical health is directly threatened, that are not regulated by the State. In the NY adaption the penal law for abortion after viability has been completely repealed. In practice this means, unlike Roe v Wade, that any medical professional that is not a licensed physician cannot be penalized for performing any abortion after viability as long as it has the mother's consent.

Penal Law

HOMICIDE[, ABORTION] AND RELATED OFFENSES
5 § 6. Section 125.00 of the penal law is amended to read as follows:
6 § 125.00 Homicide defined.
7 Homicide means conduct which causes the death of a person [or an
8 unborn child with which a female has been pregnant for more than twen-
9 ty-four weeks] under circumstances constituting murder, manslaughter in
10 the first degree, manslaughter in the second degree, or criminally
11 negligent homicide[, abortion in the first degree or self-abortion in
12 the first degree].
13 § 7. The section heading, opening paragraph and subdivision 1 of
14 section 125.05 of the penal law are amended to read as follows:
15 Homicide[, abortion] and related offenses; [definitions of terms]
16 definition.
17 The following [definitions are] definition is applicable to this arti-
18 cle:
19 [1.] "Person," when referring to the victim of a homicide, means a
20 human being who has been born and is alive.

...

28 (b) Any of the following felonies: assault in the second degree as
29 defined in section 120.05 of the penal law, assault in the first degree
30 as defined in section 120.10 of the penal law, reckless endangerment in
31 the first degree as defined in section 120.25 of the penal law, promot-
32 ing a suicide attempt as defined in section 120.30 of the penal law,
33 strangulation in the second degree as defined in section 121.12 of the
34 penal law, strangulation in the first degree as defined in section
35 121.13 of the penal law, criminally negligent homicide as defined in
36 section 125.10 of the penal law, manslaughter in the second degree as
37 defined in section 125.15 of the penal law, manslaughter in the first
38 degree as defined in section 125.20 of the penal law, murder in the
39 second degree as defined in section 125.25 of the penal law, murder in
40 the first degree as defined in section 125.27 of the penal law,
41 [abortion in the second degree as defined in section 125.40 of the penal
42 law, abortion in the first degree as defined in section 125.45 of the
43 penal law,] r*pe in the third degree as defined in section 130.25 of the
44 penal law, r*pe in the second degree as defined in section 130.30 of the
45 penal law, r*pe in the first degree as defined in section 130.35 of the
46 penal law, ...

...

28 1. A coroner or medical examiner has jurisdiction and authority to
29 investigate the death of every person dying within his county, or whose
30 body is found within the county, which is or appears to be:
31 (a) A violent death, whether by criminal violence, suicide or casual-
32 ty;
33 (b) A death caused by unlawful act or criminal neglect;
34 (c) A death occurring in a suspicious, unusual or unexplained manner;
35 (d) [A death caused by suspected criminal abortion;
36 (e)] A death while unattended by a physician, so far as can be discov-
37 ered, or where no physician able to certify the cause of death as
38 provided in the public health law and in form as prescribed by the
39 commissioner of health can be found;
40 [(f)] (e) A death of a person confined in a public institution other
41 than a hospital, infirmary or nursing home.
42 § 12. Section 4 of the judiciary law, as amended by chapter 264 of the
43 laws of 2003, is amended to read as follows:
44 § 4. Sittings of courts to be public. The sittings of every court
45 within this state shall be public, and every citizen may freely attend
46 the same, except that in all proceedings and trials in cases for
47 divorce, seduction, [abortion,] r*pe, assault with intent to commit
48 r*pe, criminal sexual act, bastardy or filiation, the court may, in its
49 discretion, exclude therefrom all persons who are not directly inter-
50 ested therein, excepting jurors, witnesses, and officers of the court.
 
Joined
Sep 5, 2018
Messages
3,259
The two main points I thought were worth of being addressed were this remark about ratio of firearm homicide to abortion:
"Yes, I had the same rate in mind. 1,3% of a million is 13,000 a year. In the USA, less people die by firearm assaults. Are deaths of firearm assault rare?"
His contention was countered with the comment that US gun murders are closer to 15,000 but that percentage technicality didn't really address the substance of what AD posted.

Also, he offered this refutation of your legal claims regarding R v. Wade which I also thought deserved to at least be addressed:
In Roe v Wade, there's a penal law for abortions after viability, except when the mother's physical health is directly threatened, that are not regulated by the State. In the NY adaption the penal law for abortion after viability has been completely repealed. In practice this means, unlike Roe v Wade, that any medical professional that is not a licensed physician cannot be penalized for performing any abortion after viability as long as it has the mother's consent.

Penal Law

HOMICIDE[, ABORTION] AND RELATED OFFENSES
5 § 6. Section 125.00 of the penal law is amended to read as follows:
6 § 125.00 Homicide defined.
7 Homicide means conduct which causes the death of a person [or an
8 unborn child with which a female has been pregnant for more than twen-
9 ty-four weeks] under circumstances constituting murder, manslaughter in
10 the first degree, manslaughter in the second degree, or criminally
11 negligent homicide[, abortion in the first degree or self-abortion in
12 the first degree].
13 § 7. The section heading, opening paragraph and subdivision 1 of
14 section 125.05 of the penal law are amended to read as follows:
15 Homicide[, abortion] and related offenses; [definitions of terms]
16 definition.
17 The following [definitions are] definition is applicable to this arti-
18 cle:
19 [1.] "Person," when referring to the victim of a homicide, means a
20 human being who has been born and is alive.

...

28 (b) Any of the following felonies: assault in the second degree as
29 defined in section 120.05 of the penal law, assault in the first degree
30 as defined in section 120.10 of the penal law, reckless endangerment in
31 the first degree as defined in section 120.25 of the penal law, promot-
32 ing a suicide attempt as defined in section 120.30 of the penal law,
33 strangulation in the second degree as defined in section 121.12 of the
34 penal law, strangulation in the first degree as defined in section
35 121.13 of the penal law, criminally negligent homicide as defined in
36 section 125.10 of the penal law, manslaughter in the second degree as
37 defined in section 125.15 of the penal law, manslaughter in the first
38 degree as defined in section 125.20 of the penal law, murder in the
39 second degree as defined in section 125.25 of the penal law, murder in
40 the first degree as defined in section 125.27 of the penal law,
41 [abortion in the second degree as defined in section 125.40 of the penal
42 law, abortion in the first degree as defined in section 125.45 of the
43 penal law,] r*pe in the third degree as defined in section 130.25 of the
44 penal law, r*pe in the second degree as defined in section 130.30 of the
45 penal law, r*pe in the first degree as defined in section 130.35 of the
46 penal law, ...

...

28 1. A coroner or medical examiner has jurisdiction and authority to
29 investigate the death of every person dying within his county, or whose
30 body is found within the county, which is or appears to be:
31 (a) A violent death, whether by criminal violence, suicide or casual-
32 ty;
33 (b) A death caused by unlawful act or criminal neglect;
34 (c) A death occurring in a suspicious, unusual or unexplained manner;
35 (d) [A death caused by suspected criminal abortion;
36 (e)] A death while unattended by a physician, so far as can be discov-
37 ered, or where no physician able to certify the cause of death as
38 provided in the public health law and in form as prescribed by the
39 commissioner of health can be found;
40 [(f)] (e) A death of a person confined in a public institution other
41 than a hospital, infirmary or nursing home.
42 § 12. Section 4 of the judiciary law, as amended by chapter 264 of the
43 laws of 2003, is amended to read as follows
44 § 4. Sittings of courts to be public. The sittings of every court
45 within this state shall be public, and every citizen may freely attend
46 the same, except that in all proceedings and trials in cases for
47 divorce, seduction, [abortion,] r*pe, assault with intent to commit
48 r*pe, criminal sexual act, bastardy or filiation, the court may, in its
49 discretion, exclude therefrom all persons who are not directly inter-
50 ested therein, excepting jurors, witnesses, and officers of the court.

His number of 1m was also incorrect. There haven’t been 1m plus abortions performed in a year since 1997, so the 1.3% is indeed rare, and less than gun murders, US has high rates of violent crime compared to other Western democracies but it’s still actually pretty rare, and trending down.

Abortions are trending down as well, and that’s a good thing. I’d love to live in a society where the only abortions performed are out of medical necessity. OTC birth control and fact based sex-Ed I believe would help to continue lowering rates.

Personally I’m actually pro-life, I would never encourage someone to have one, but this isn’t my call man.

https://www.google.com/amp/amp.timeinc.net/time/5461616/abortions-lowest-rate-cdc
 
Last edited:

justjess

Superstar
Joined
Mar 16, 2017
Messages
11,510
How is a pregnant woman forced to endure childbirth “against her own wishes”?

She KNEW the consequences of her actions when having sex. If she was truly concerned about the reality of giving birth, she should never have spread her legs.

It really is that simple.

Say what you wish, but It IS absolute HYPOCRISY to claim you care about women’s, children or human rights while advocating to choose to murder them when they are most vulnerable & helpless. There is no way to sugarcoat it.

If you cared about or valued all human life, you would stop the insanity of playing good cop bad cop.

Their is NO gray area when it comes to butchering babies....born or unborn.

YOU have been born, nobody painfully ripped you from your mother’s womb.....why do you think YOU have the right to decide that someone else’s life should continue or end based on YOUR “choice”?

Who made YOU judge, jury & executioner of a completely INNOCENT baby who has done NOTHING wrong & is completely incapable of fighting for the life they have ALREADY begun?
Advocate for abortion? Please show me where I did that... I’ll wait.

I also don’t believe a fetus is a person at conception which was also the belief of early churches so take it up with them.
 

justjess

Superstar
Joined
Mar 16, 2017
Messages
11,510
The two main points I thought were worth of being addressed were this remark about ratio of firearm homicide to abortion:
"Yes, I had the same rate in mind. 1,3% of a million is 13,000 a year. In the USA, less people die by firearm assaults. Are deaths of firearm assault rare?"
His contention was countered with the comment that US gun murders are closer to 15,000 but that percentage technicality didn't really address the substance of what AD posted.

Also, he offered this refutation of your legal claims regarding R v. Wade which I also thought deserved to at least be addressed:
In Roe v Wade, there's a penal law for abortions after viability, except when the mother's physical health is directly threatened, that are not regulated by the State. In the NY adaption the penal law for abortion after viability has been completely repealed. In practice this means, unlike Roe v Wade, that any medical professional that is not a licensed physician cannot be penalized for performing any abortion after viability as long as it has the mother's consent.

Penal Law

HOMICIDE[, ABORTION] AND RELATED OFFENSES
5 § 6. Section 125.00 of the penal law is amended to read as follows:
6 § 125.00 Homicide defined.
7 Homicide means conduct which causes the death of a person [or an
8 unborn child with which a female has been pregnant for more than twen-
9 ty-four weeks] under circumstances constituting murder, manslaughter in
10 the first degree, manslaughter in the second degree, or criminally
11 negligent homicide[, abortion in the first degree or self-abortion in
12 the first degree].
13 § 7. The section heading, opening paragraph and subdivision 1 of
14 section 125.05 of the penal law are amended to read as follows:
15 Homicide[, abortion] and related offenses; [definitions of terms]
16 definition.
17 The following [definitions are] definition is applicable to this arti-
18 cle:
19 [1.] "Person," when referring to the victim of a homicide, means a
20 human being who has been born and is alive.

...

28 (b) Any of the following felonies: assault in the second degree as
29 defined in section 120.05 of the penal law, assault in the first degree
30 as defined in section 120.10 of the penal law, reckless endangerment in
31 the first degree as defined in section 120.25 of the penal law, promot-
32 ing a suicide attempt as defined in section 120.30 of the penal law,
33 strangulation in the second degree as defined in section 121.12 of the
34 penal law, strangulation in the first degree as defined in section
35 121.13 of the penal law, criminally negligent homicide as defined in
36 section 125.10 of the penal law, manslaughter in the second degree as
37 defined in section 125.15 of the penal law, manslaughter in the first
38 degree as defined in section 125.20 of the penal law, murder in the
39 second degree as defined in section 125.25 of the penal law, murder in
40 the first degree as defined in section 125.27 of the penal law,
41 [abortion in the second degree as defined in section 125.40 of the penal
42 law, abortion in the first degree as defined in section 125.45 of the
43 penal law,] r*pe in the third degree as defined in section 130.25 of the
44 penal law, r*pe in the second degree as defined in section 130.30 of the
45 penal law, r*pe in the first degree as defined in section 130.35 of the
46 penal law, ...

...

28 1. A coroner or medical examiner has jurisdiction and authority to
29 investigate the death of every person dying within his county, or whose
30 body is found within the county, which is or appears to be:
31 (a) A violent death, whether by criminal violence, suicide or casual-
32 ty;
33 (b) A death caused by unlawful act or criminal neglect;
34 (c) A death occurring in a suspicious, unusual or unexplained manner;
35 (d) [A death caused by suspected criminal abortion;
36 (e)] A death while unattended by a physician, so far as can be discov-
37 ered, or where no physician able to certify the cause of death as
38 provided in the public health law and in form as prescribed by the
39 commissioner of health can be found;
40 [(f)] (e) A death of a person confined in a public institution other
41 than a hospital, infirmary or nursing home.
42 § 12. Section 4 of the judiciary law, as amended by chapter 264 of the
43 laws of 2003, is amended to read as follows:
44 § 4. Sittings of courts to be public. The sittings of every court
45 within this state shall be public, and every citizen may freely attend
46 the same, except that in all proceedings and trials in cases for
47 divorce, seduction, [abortion,] r*pe, assault with intent to commit
48 r*pe, criminal sexual act, bastardy or filiation, the court may, in its
49 discretion, exclude therefrom all persons who are not directly inter-
50 ested therein, excepting jurors, witnesses, and officers of the court.
I don’t know where that penal code came from but it isn’t from roe v Wade. I’d love to know where it came from actually...

If the federal penal code includes that then the N.Y. law wouldn’t invalidate it, it could still be charged on a federal level.
 

TempestOfTempo

Superstar
Joined
Jan 29, 2018
Messages
8,076
I don’t know where that penal code came from but it isn’t from roe v Wade. I’d love to know where it came from actually...

If the federal penal code includes that then the N.Y. law wouldn’t invalidate it, it could still be charged on a federal level.
So assuming what was posted is applicable, do you feel this accelerates the threshold for when abortions are allowed beyond what RvWade allowed for, or is it too left field to be relevant? Im not trying to be slick, just trying to understand your perspective.
 

justjess

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Mar 16, 2017
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11,510
I don’t know where it came from, and I don’t believe that it does anything since the N.Y. law only codifies on a state level what roe codified on a federal. It didn’t change anything of substance. You still can’t get an abortion past 24 weeks without extraordinary circumstances. And if you look at the websites of abortion clinics in nyc they will still reflect this.
 
Joined
Apr 13, 2017
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Colonel,

The 1 million is an average taken from more or less the past 50 years. It tends to fluctuate around 1 million.

But at least you’re consistent in your interpretation of rare.


Justjess,

I hyperlinked the source in “Penal Law”.

It’s from the NY legislation.
 
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