16 Year OId bashed online by group of MGTOW. What is this movement?

[Glossolalien]

I love how people conveniently ignore the real catalyst of the gender war. Because the biggest divider of the family, is obviously capitalism. Capitalism gave us this system of the haves, and have not. Maybe you are all too wrapped up in these social distractions. But it's pretty clear when you break it all down.

Prior to feminism the people who had everything. Was the Men. They set the rules, they made the money. They had all of the rights. And people act like this was some kind of golden age of America. But what evidence is there of that? I don't think there any with real substance. You all just like hating on feminism because it's popular to do so on the internet.

So what I'm saying is, feminism is like some kind of glorified Union. The tyranny and oppression from capitalism forced women into turning to "collective bargaining". I get that I'm probably preaching to the choir. Most people either know nothing of economics, or are all in with the notion that unions are evil. Yes, let's blame each other for standing up for ourselves.

Some of you seem perfectly fine getting shit on by the elite. Like you gobble it up.

Aero, I am not an uber-rightwinger but Capitalism is thus far the best system as of yet to come about in large scale economies. I'm sure small communities are better off with a socialist system but there is a definitely an upper limit on how big that can get. I'm not sure what governmental system you're advocating for, but capitalism is far superior to everything that's been tried as of yet.

In fact, the irony of this post and the ignorance of the statements made here is mind-boggling. So prior to feminism, let's define that. We are going to be looking at around the middle of the 19th century. What kind of jobs did most people work? They were hard jobs and they required raw physical strength and most of them were quite dangerous. You simply didn't have 9-5 office jobs. The jobs that were worked in offices just weren't that common. Computers didn't exist, and the fastest way to communicate was a telegram or sending a hand written letter. So asking why men had the bulk of jobs is because they were the ones who made the industries that employed people. It's like asking why most rappers are black. Well black people created the style and are usually the best at it, and then there is Eminem. Would it make sense to start a campaign against black people for creating a monopoly on rap music? No. Women didn't work in steel foundries, coal mines, loggers, railroad builders, oil rigs and etc because they were industries that had requirements only strong men fulfill. I'm willing to bet the average man in the 19th century was a lot stronger than the men of today's society simply based on the need to do hard physical work everyday.

The irony is that this capitalist system created an environment where industries flourished and research and development exploded. It created an environment that gave us the technology to have all of these modern jobs that women are capable of doing as well as a man. Look at a graph of how technology grew exponentially during that time period. Women would not want to work "just like the boys do" if we were to dial the clock back 150-200 years. It is only today that women now want to break their traditional role because they somehow got the idea that the only way to be free is to be exactly like men and that working at home is some sort of punishment.

Capitalism isn't perfect by any stretch and it's pretty clear the honeymoon phase is over but it changed the world. America was a great experiment and no people have ever been as free. I'm still shocked when I interact with certain cultures who treat others differently based on who their parents are. It's a totally foreign concept to me.

The simple fact is without capitalism there wouldn't be jobs women would want to work at and you certainly would not have the internet to communicate this idea. The evidence of this golden age is the incredible standard of living the Western world has. Electricity, running water, fast food, local grocery stores stocked with anything you could ever want. If you took a person from the 19th century to a local supermarket they would be shocked at the amount and quality of food available. Life was way different before refrigeration.

Why do men set the rules? They fight the fights that setup nations, so naturally after victory they set the agenda. Women influence the men at home. Why don't the women fight instead? I'm sure they have in the past but what happens is they lose against men. Standing armies of women just aren't a thing outside of marvel comic books. They were essentially completely unable to fight until guns became a thing. Men are to protect and serve the women, doing the hard work that no one wants to do so they can enjoy the good things in life like raising a family. It's not punishment but you've been convinced by a cabal of very evil men that this is so.

I'm all for women being treated equally and fairly but I just don't see how they are oppressed in this modern world. You and others seem to be at odds with reality and no one can help you with that. There's a deeper agenda here, and hopefully you'll be able to see it someday.

 

[rainerann]

Aero, I am not an uber-rightwinger but Capitalism is thus far the best system as of yet to come about in large scale economies. I'm sure small communities are better off with a socialist system but there is a definitely an upper limit on how big that can get. I'm not sure what governmental system you're advocating for, but capitalism is far superior to everything that's been tried as of yet.

In fact, the irony of this post and the ignorance of the statements made here is mind-boggling. So prior to feminism, let's define that. We are going to be looking at around the middle of the 19th century. What kind of jobs did most people work? They were hard jobs and they required raw physical strength and most of them were quite dangerous. You simply didn't have 9-5 office jobs. The jobs that were worked in offices just weren't that common. Computers didn't exist, and the fastest way to communicate was a telegram or sending a hand written letter. So asking why men had the bulk of jobs is because they were the ones who made the industries that employed people. It's like asking why most rappers are black. Well black people created the style and are usually the best at it, and then there is Eminem. Would it make sense to start a campaign against black people for creating a monopoly on rap music? No. Women didn't work in steel foundries, coal mines, loggers, railroad builders, oil rigs and etc because they were industries that had requirements only strong men fulfill. I'm willing to bet the average man in the 19th century was a lot stronger than the men of today's society simply based on the need to do hard physical work everyday.

The irony is that this capitalist system created an environment where industries flourished and research and development exploded. It created an environment that gave us the technology to have all of these modern jobs that women are capable of doing as well as a man. Look at a graph of how technology grew exponentially during that time period. Women would not want to work "just like the boys do" if we were to dial the clock back 150-200 years. It is only today that women now want to break their traditional role because they somehow got the idea that the only way to be free is to be exactly like men and that working at home is some sort of punishment.

Capitalism isn't perfect by any stretch and it's pretty clear the honeymoon phase is over but it changed the world. America was a great experiment and no people have ever been as free. I'm still shocked when I interact with certain cultures who treat others differently based on who their parents are. It's a totally foreign concept to me.

The simple fact is without capitalism there wouldn't be jobs women would want to work at and you certainly would not have the internet to communicate this idea. The evidence of this golden age is the incredible standard of living the Western world has. Electricity, running water, fast food, local grocery stores stocked with anything you could ever want. If you took a person from the 19th century to a local supermarket they would be shocked at the amount and quality of food available. Life was way different before refrigeration.

Why do men set the rules? They fight the fights that setup nations, so naturally after victory they set the agenda. Women influence the men at home. Why don't the women fight instead? I'm sure they have in the past but what happens is they lose against men. Standing armies of women just aren't a thing outside of marvel comic books. They were essentially completely unable to fight until guns became a thing. Men are to protect and serve the women, doing the hard work that no one wants to do so they can enjoy the good things in life like raising a family. It's not punishment but you've been convinced by a cabal of very evil men that this is so.

I'm all for women being treated equally and fairly but I just don't see how they are oppressed in this modern world. You and others seem to be at odds with reality and no one can help you with that. There's a deeper agenda here, and hopefully you'll be able to see it someday.

Men were stronger or they were dead in the 19th century. The workload created a much higher injury rate back then. I remember reading about how employers expected a certain percentage of their employees to die building bridges or doing other jobs. Labor is much different and it could be said that the industrial revolution played a role in the discussion of feminism. Some women are capable of working on a railroad or whatever, and laundry is very physical work without a washing machine. However, it still can’t be denied that before the industrial revolution began, work was distributed by physical capabilities that have played a major role in determining classic gender roles.

 

[mecca]

Aero, I am not an uber-rightwinger but Capitalism is thus far the best system as of yet to come about in large scale economies. I'm sure small communities are better off with a socialist system but there is a definitely an upper limit on how big that can get. I'm not sure what governmental system you're advocating for, but capitalism is far superior to everything that's been tried as of yet.

In fact, the irony of this post and the ignorance of the statements made here is mind-boggling. So prior to feminism, let's define that. We are going to be looking at around the middle of the 19th century. What kind of jobs did most people work? They were hard jobs and they required raw physical strength and most of them were quite dangerous. You simply didn't have 9-5 office jobs. The jobs that were worked in offices just weren't that common. Computers didn't exist, and the fastest way to communicate was a telegram or sending a hand written letter. So asking why men had the bulk of jobs is because they were the ones who made the industries that employed people. It's like asking why most rappers are black. Well black people created the style and are usually the best at it, and then there is Eminem. Would it make sense to start a campaign against black people for creating a monopoly on rap music? No. Women didn't work in steel foundries, coal mines, loggers, railroad builders, oil rigs and etc because they were industries that had requirements only strong men fulfill. I'm willing to bet the average man in the 19th century was a lot stronger than the men of today's society simply based on the need to do hard physical work everyday.

The irony is that this capitalist system created an environment where industries flourished and research and development exploded. It created an environment that gave us the technology to have all of these modern jobs that women are capable of doing as well as a man. Look at a graph of how technology grew exponentially during that time period. Women would not want to work "just like the boys do" if we were to dial the clock back 150-200 years. It is only today that women now want to break their traditional role because they somehow got the idea that the only way to be free is to be exactly like men and that working at home is some sort of punishment.

Capitalism isn't perfect by any stretch and it's pretty clear the honeymoon phase is over but it changed the world. America was a great experiment and no people have ever been as free. I'm still shocked when I interact with certain cultures who treat others differently based on who their parents are. It's a totally foreign concept to me.

The simple fact is without capitalism there wouldn't be jobs women would want to work at and you certainly would not have the internet to communicate this idea. The evidence of this golden age is the incredible standard of living the Western world has. Electricity, running water, fast food, local grocery stores stocked with anything you could ever want. If you took a person from the 19th century to a local supermarket they would be shocked at the amount and quality of food available. Life was way different before refrigeration.

Why do men set the rules? They fight the fights that setup nations, so naturally after victory they set the agenda. Women influence the men at home. Why don't the women fight instead? I'm sure they have in the past but what happens is they lose against men. Standing armies of women just aren't a thing outside of marvel comic books. They were essentially completely unable to fight until guns became a thing. Men are to protect and serve the women, doing the hard work that no one wants to do so they can enjoy the good things in life like raising a family. It's not punishment but you've been convinced by a cabal of very evil men that this is so.

I'm all for women being treated equally and fairly but I just don't see how they are oppressed in this modern world. You and others seem to be at odds with reality and no one can help you with that. There's a deeper agenda here, and hopefully you'll be able to see it someday.

From the Women In the Workforce Wikipedia page:

Women have worked at agricultural tasks since ancient times, and continue to do so around the world. The Industrial Revolution of the late 18th and early 19th centuries changed the nature of work in Europe and other countries of the Western world. Working for a wage, and eventually a salary, became part of urban life. Initially, women were to be found doing even the hardest physical labor, including working as "hurriers" hauling heavy coal carts through mine shafts in Great Britain, a job that also employed many children. This ended after government intervention and the passing of the Mines and Collieries Act 1842, an early attempt at regulating the workplace.

Women have always worked and done manual labor since the dawn of time. In 19th century Britain, even children did hard manual labor, women certainly did as well.

During the 19th century, an increasing number of women in Western countries took jobs in factories, such as textile mills, or on assembly lines for machinery or other goods. Inequality in wages was to be expected for women. In 1906, the government found that the average weekly factory wage for a woman ranged from 11s 3d to 18s 8d, whereas a man's average weekly wage was around 25s 9d. Childminding was another necessary expense for many women working in factories. Pregnant women worked up until the day they gave birth and returned to work as soon as they were physically able. In 1891, a law was passed requiring women to take four weeks away from factory work after giving birth, but many women could not afford this unpaid leave, and the law was unenforceable.

The 1870 US Census was the first United States Census to count “Females engaged in each occupation” and provides an intriguing snapshot of women's history. It reveals that, contrary to popular belief, not all American women of the 19th century were either idle in their middle-class homes or working in sweatshops. Women were 15% of the total work force (1.8 million out of 12.5). They made up one-third of factory “operatives,” but teaching and the occupations of dressmaking, millinery, and tailoring played a larger role. Two-thirds of teachers were women. Women could also be found in such unexpected places as iron and steel works (495), mines (46), sawmills (35), oil wells and refineries (40), gas works (4), and charcoal kilns (5) and held such surprising jobs as ship rigger (16), teamster (196), turpentine laborer (185), brass founder/worker (102), shingle and lathe maker (84), stock-herder (45), gun and locksmith (33), hunter and trapper (2).

And that's just the part on 19th century Britain and the US... there's plenty more history regarding women working in other parts of the world and in earlier time periods.

Throughout history women have worked and women have had to work to survive. Most working class women didn't have the luxury to stay home all day. Here is a decent article as well: https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/apr/13/working-women-stay-at-home-wives-myths

 

[rainerann]

These jobs that women did still demonstrate that work was distributed by physical capabilities and this defined traditional gender roles the way we presently know them. They were long hours. They were necessary jobs. The value of their work is equal, but you can't make an argument that women could keep up with the work required before the introduction of machines very often. Men couldn't keep up with it, and many of them died doing it.

I don't know if they teach the American tall tales anymore, but when I little I remember learning the song of John Henry. John Henry was a super strong guy who could hammer in the nails for the railroad so fast. However, this is what killed him and the story finishes telling about how he died doing this work. There is a reason someone wrote this tall tale because of how it represented a somewhat exaggerated view of the reality of the time. Building railroads was not something a woman was capable of doing very often, but that is okay because that wasn't the problem.

The problem was that women were treated the same way a small man is treated for not being physically able to do the same amount of work and the value of work was defined by how much you could lift and not by how much value your work brings to the community. Women's rights should be about women doing what women are good at doing where they are given as much respect for doing this as a man would be given for doing whatever he is good at doing. That is what women's rights is about. Having a world where a woman can seek justice when she is experiencing discrimination. Our whole definition of what women need in the modern age to continue pursuing a greater quality of life is so distorted.

Historically, men and women have not been capable of doing the same jobs. That is just a fact, and this has defined traditional gender roles the way we know them. The women's movement seems to think changing this fact will be a way to make the world see women differently, but women don't need to change. That is the point of women's rights. We don't need to change to be seen or treated differently or better, which has nothing to do with saying women should stay at home. It is just saying women should do what they are good at and there should be a defense when they are hindered from doing something they are capable of doing well.

However, my problem with this is that most people seem to do that these days. I look on Pinterest. I see pictures from all the mom blogs with recipes for veggie this or that and pictures of some DIY craft project that kids will love. They have great ideas, but the point is that the world is looking at women doing the most traditional things and saying that this is a valuable contribution. However, the feminists seem to be the ones with the biggest problem with women doing things like this because of how this seems to threaten their argument that the world needs to think that women can become John Henry's. I think women need a movement to protect ourselves from the feminists these days. The world has changed a lot. So finding ways to move forward requires change as well.

I also take great offense to the 15% notion in that article suggesting something about women at all. I guarantee you that a housewife in the 19th century was not sitting at home twiddling her thumbs. It is not enough to say that being a mother is a lot of work. People say that and people respond in a PC way that is really somewhat superficial and lacking in any real depth that can convey what being a mother requires. There is no real comparison to the way we expect babies in the modern world and the way they would have in the past. It's not the crying or changing diapers or lack of sleep. It is the Desitin or baby wipes or washing machine that make it all seem manageable to consider going to work after you have a baby.

For example diapers. For years we have enjoyed disposable diapers. Do you know what it would be like to have to handwash baby diapers in a house that doesn't have running water with some kind of soap made out of animal fat? Not just that. Picture only having 10 diapers to use for your baby because that was all you could afford. You will probably need to change a baby as many as ten times a day, which means every single day in addition to feeding and keeping the baby clean, you have to wash all the diapers by hand. That's why there was only 15% of them that had jobs outside the home. No housewife was ever staying at home leisurely twiddling in the 19th century. That fact still feels like the most surprising thing to take away from that article about women working in the 19th century, and that is probably the only real reason women need to continue pursuing a better quality of life. People still don't think they worked when they stayed at home in the 19th century. They want to make it out like they had jobs and this is supposed to prove something. Aye...

We should all be grateful for the way machines alleviate the hardships that many people experienced for hundreds of years as well. Life has really been awful for everyone throughout history.

 

[Aero]

I'm not sure what governmental system you're advocating for, but capitalism is far superior to everything that's been tried as of yet.

Pretty sure China and Russia are doing pretty well. Some would argue, they are doing better than us. And I would go through the rest of your post, but there just isn't much worth responding to. You are acting like the King of conjecture. But that's not a rare thing in this thread.

If you go back through history you will see women playing a much larger role in the ancient world. There were Queens leading men into battle. Women were cross dressing to look like men on the battlefield. They were just expected to do so much more. There are many examples of women breaking the mold.

After Christianity blew up, all of that shit changed. The role of women was made smaller and smaller. Until the point where they had to create feminism just to get out of the house.

 

[mecca]

The problem was that women were treated the same way a small man is treated for not being physically able to do the same amount of work and the value of work was defined by how much you could lift and not by how much value your work brings to the community.

Exactly and that's partially the fault of capitalism. Housework is not valued and many women did housework. Capitalism has not helped women. It reduced the importance of women and common jobs that women did. Before capitalism, the home was the central unit of production and women had important roles in running things like farms or just doing a bunch of work around the house. But when capitalism started, men began to be able to take paid labor jobs outside of the home but all the work the women were doing at home was unnoticed and they could not make money from it even if they worked harder than their husbands. Jobs that many women do are not profitable. Even jobs and careers that many women are in make less money than the careers men are traditionally in. Women have a right to be able to have careers and opportunities outside of the house but women also have the choice to stay at home. Feminists are not against women being able to make that choice and they do bring light to the ways that women's work in the home is undervalued.

 

[Glossolalien]

Pretty sure China and Russia are doing pretty well. Some would argue, they are doing better than us. And I would go through the rest of your post, but there just isn't much worth responding to. You are acting like the King of conjecture. But that's not a rare thing in this thread.

If you go back through history you will see women playing a much larger role in the ancient world. There were Queens leading men into battle. Women were cross dressing to look like men on the battlefield. They were just expected to do so much more. There are many examples of women breaking the mold.

After Christianity blew up, all of that shit changed. The role of women was made smaller and smaller. Until the point where they had to create feminism just to get out of the house.

Seriously what are you talking about? You don't have an argument and you and mecca don't even have a position other than "women are oppressed." You never mention how they are oppressed. China and russia are not doing better than us. China is one of the most corrupt countries in the world and Russia isn't far behind. They were starving until they adopted some sort of capitalism into their economies. Have massive amounts of people ever starved to death in America because there wasn't enough food? Try having more than one kid in China, yeah it's a real woman's paradise there. Women have always played a huge role(example: I never said they didn't but you're responding in a way that suggests your addressing a point I made because you have no real argument) and you don't have a position to defend so you're just throwing around ideas so that it looks like you have a point.

You literally have no answers to my points and the hypocrisy of complaining about a system that gave you the means to be allowed to complain is ironic beyond belief.

Why don't you and Mecca ever define what your complaints are? That's the main difference between men and women, men get an idea and they go out and do it. If a woman wants to go out and get a high paying job, then she should go and do it. There are no laws against it in the U.S.

It looks like you visited the wiki page on women fighting throughout history and surprise surprise, there wasn't much there. A queen led troops once, maybe it happened more than once but they didn't mention it. How many battles have taken place that were led by men? What does Christianity have to do with this? All you are doing is inspiring feelings and not giving any facts or details, talk about conjecture. Seriously, are you trolling in a way where you take the most hypocritical position possible just to see if people will notice? This is the classic echo chamber where feelings are passed around and everyone feels real good about the subject but its all a fantasy. If you would like to go live somewhere you think is doing better than here, that is fine by me, but there are legitimate human right's violations taking place there so I'd do some research first.

 

[mecca]

You don't have an argument and you and mecca don't even have a position other than "women are oppressed."

Either you don't have very good reading comprehension or you're just making stuff up.

 

[Glossolalien]

Either you don't have very good reading comprehension or you're just making stuff up.

Mecca this has become a meta-conversation that is about feminism, and not what feminism is about, neither you or Aero seem to be very specific with even your definition of feminism and what the goal is. I see that you believe half of the population is oppressed, and that you don't receive equal treatment but that's about it.

I'm asking a straightforward question. In what ways are you oppressed and in what ways are women receiving unequal treatment? In fact, I don't even know if I disagree with you because I don't know what you're complaining about. Why would I be asking this question? Feminism today, seems to me like a nebulous set of loosely defined ideas that are brought up any time a woman doesn't have things go their way or when a politician tries to justify the murder of infants. If there were clear cut examples maybe I could decide if I agree or disagree.

An example would be of a systematic discriminatory policy or an outright law against a freedom or right of women. Something, like women are not allowed to vote or not allowed to go to school. If they are forcing you out of a career that you feel you are equally qualified for, then how is it happening, where is it happening?

If you don't have actually have a position then it's quite easy just to move your own set of ideas in a way that always counters whatever your ideological opponent is stating. Politicians do this all the time and it gives the illusion that one side actually has a goal or goals and a plan to accomplish them, but in reality they are just trying to get votes and in this case on the forum the perception that they're winning some sort of argument.

 

[Aero]

Seriously what are you talking about? You don't have an argument and you and mecca don't even have a position other than "women are oppressed." You never mention how they are oppressed. China and russia are not doing better than us. China is one of the most corrupt countries in the world and Russia isn't far behind. They were starving until they adopted some sort of capitalism into their economies. Have massive amounts of people ever starved to death in America because there wasn't enough food? Try having more than one kid in China, yeah it's a real woman's paradise there. Women have always played a huge role(example: I never said they didn't but you're responding in a way that suggests your addressing a point I made because you have no real argument) and you don't have a position to defend so you're just throwing around ideas so that it looks like you have a point.

An estimated 48.8 million Americans , including 16.2 million children, live in households that lack the means to get enough nutritious food on a regular basis. China has the worlds largest economy based on purchasing power. China owns part of America, and I don't think we own any part of China.

I'm not saying hey, let's turn into communists. But when you act like Capitalism is all that's good. You are just flat out wrong. That's why I called you Mr. Conjecture.

You literally have no answers to my points and the hypocrisy of complaining about a system that gave you the means to be allowed to complain is ironic beyond belief.

Why don't you and Mecca ever define what your complaints are? That's the main difference between men and women, men get an idea and they go out and do it. If a woman wants to go out and get a high paying job, then she should go and do it. There are no laws against it in the U.S.

Well I don't have to answer a point that is false. But I actually did refute a lot of your points. That's why I brought up China and Russia. Because their technological advancements are just as good, if not better than ours. So your point about Capitalism being the cause of women being able to work, and the cause of our advancements is a false cause fallacy.

And pretty sure our complaints are obvious. There's still a huge gender pay gap. Women are harassed or assaulted on a daily basis by bros. They aren't allowed to make decisions about their own bodies. Plus there is a whole lot of men in the world who are threatened by women with power. That's why they don't get the high paying jobs. Women CEOs are still a pretty rare thing. Why do you think that is? Aren't they as smart as a man?

It looks like you visited the wiki page on women fighting throughout history and surprise surprise, there wasn't much there. A queen led troops once, maybe it happened more than once but they didn't mention it. How many battles have taken place that were led by men? What does Christianity have to do with this? All you are doing is inspiring feelings and not giving any facts or details, talk about conjecture. Seriously, are you trolling in a way where you take the most hypocritical position possible just to see if people will notice? This is the classic echo chamber where feelings are passed around and everyone feels real good about the subject but its all a fantasy. If you would like to go live somewhere you think is doing better than here, that is fine by me, but there are legitimate human right's violations taking place there so I'd do some research first.

Oh wow. Your fan boy attitude is glaring. And like all of your posts, you simply lack facts. I'm really wondering where you have picked up this stuff from. Nothing I wrote is conjecture. Women literally aren't allowed any big role in the Christian church. There aren't any high ranking women in the Military. These are called facts, I know the truth hurts sometimes, but deal with it. I'm giving clear examples of women having bigger roles in the past compared to today.

In conclusion just because people don't come out and say "women belong in the kitchen hahaha bitches". Doesn't mean their behavior isn't having drastic effects on everyone. That's the type of shit that needs to stop. Just treat women as equals. Why is that so hard?

 

[Glossolalien]

An estimated 48.8 million Americans , including 16.2 million children, live in households that lack the means to get enough nutritious food on a regular basis. China has the worlds largest economy based on purchasing power. China owns part of America, and I don't think we own any part of China.

I'm not saying hey, let's turn into communists. But when you act like Capitalism is all that's good. You are just flat out wrong. That's why I called you Mr. Conjecture.

Well I don't have to answer a point that is false. But I actually did refute a lot of your points. That's why I brought up China and Russia. Because their technological advancements are just as good, if not better than ours. So your point about Capitalism being the cause of women being able to work, and the cause of our advancements is a false cause fallacy.

And pretty sure our complaints are obvious. There's still a huge gender pay gap. Women are harassed or assaulted on a daily basis by bros. They aren't allowed to make decisions about their own bodies. Plus there is a whole lot of men in the world who are threatened by women with power. That's why they don't get the high paying jobs. Women CEOs are still a pretty rare thing. Why do you think that is? Aren't they as smart as a man?



Oh wow. Your fan boy attitude is glaring. And like all of your posts, you simply lack facts. I'm really wondering where you have picked up this stuff from. Nothing I wrote is conjecture. Women literally aren't allowed any big role in the Christian church. There aren't any high ranking women in the Military. These are called facts, I know the truth hurts sometimes, but deal with it. I'm giving clear examples of women having bigger roles in the past compared to today.

In conclusion just because people don't come out and say "women belong in the kitchen hahaha bitches". Doesn't mean their behavior isn't having drastic effects on everyone. That's the type of shit that needs to stop. Just treat women as equals. Why is that so hard?

Aero, when in American history have millions of people ever starved to death simply because there was a lack of food?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Chinese_Famine

Do you think I didn't know that there are poor people in America?

Catch up on some history. Additionally, while some great innovations are based out of China, they are for the most part only good at copying American or other Western technology. In fact they are notorious for stealing other's work. But I bet you don't own a business that manufactures anything in China and you aren't worried about intellectual theft.

Did you know while the whole world was going through the industrial revolution the Chinese were struggling with how to manufacture steel? Why do Chinese people have an economy? Well, we started making all of our goods there because both the men and women don't make any money at all. So American companies sold out the USA and took manufacturing to a place where the workers are paid pennies on the dollar. Most of the expensive houses in LA that are being bought exclusively by Chinese government officials that are setting up their sons and daughters, many from illicit affairs to live in the USA because it sucks so bad in China. Here's a quick documentary on that if you want to learn more.

Did you know that in China you can only have one child? Who in America can't make decisions regarding their own body? Do you really think you are better off in China as a woman?

Pay gap and pay inequality. My take on it is this, in the jobs I have worked I haven't seen it. I have been underpaid and do you know what? I simply left that company and found someone to pay me for my skills. That is how supply and demand works. If you supply something that is worth a certain amount then you can always find demand for it. Further, the evidence is only there for a gender pay gap not a gender wage gap. What that means is that yes, men make more money, but men don't make more money if they have the same educational background, experience and other qualifiers. Some reasons might be...

1. Men disproportionately gravitate towards higher paying occupations in technology and hard sciences (e.g., petroleum engineer).
2. Men disproportionately choose higher-risk, higher paying occupations with greater safety risks for occupational injuries and fatalities (e.g., oil field worker, roofer, and logging).
3. Men are more willing to work outdoors in uncomfortable, physically demanding work environments (construction, oil field workers, commercial fishing, logging).
4. Men are more willing than women to choose demanding, intense jobs where you can’t check out at the end of the work day (e.g., corporate attorney, senior White House staff).
5. Men select jobs with higher pay but with lower personal fulfillment (tax accountant).
6. Men select jobs with higher financial and emotional risks (e.g., venture capitalist).
7. Men are more willing than women to work the worst shifts during the worst hours.
8. Men often choose higher paying subfields (e.g., surgery and anesthesiology).
9. Men are more willing to work in dirty or unpleasant environments with minimal human contact (e.g., prison guard, steel worker, truck drivers).
10. Men work longer hours per week than women on average.
11. Men more frequently than women invest in updating their skills with greater financial payoffs (e.g., master’s degree in computer technology vs. master’s degree in education).
12. Men are more likely than women to have more years of continuous experience in their current occupation.
13. Men are more likely than women to have more years of recent, uninterrupted experience with their current employer.
14. More work more weeks during the year than women, on average.
15. Men are less likely than women to be absent from work (e.g., doctor’s visits, sick days, taking time off when children are sick, etc.).
16. Men are more willing than women to tolerate longer commute times.
17. Men are more willing to relocate, especially to undesirable locations at their company’s request.
18. Men are more willing than women, on average, to travel extensively on the job.
19. Men are more willing than women to take the risk of a variable income, e.g., to be paid by commission vs. a fixed salary.
20. Men often produce more output, e.g., scholarly research articles for university professors.

As for women being CEOs or other very high paying jobs, again this is basic economics. If there was a better woman candidate for a CEO position than a man and the man was still selected then that company is not going to do as well. These people are absolute sharks and if they can make more money with a woman then they will absolutely hire a woman for the CEO position. Politics don't matter to these people, the bottom line is always money.

Are you a Christian? Were you disappointed not to get a position in the Church? Should the state dictate who the church puts into positions of power? This is the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard. Men are in the military because men are stronger and until guns were invented it was very rare to see a female soldier. I want the very best in the military and until women show they are superior fighters then I am glad it's men in charge. To put a female in the military in a high ranking position is to put the military and nation at risk and until you prove that's not the case then keeping men in charge of the military is in the best interest of everyone. You have to prove your ability which men have done time after time. No group has the right to dictate how any religion works, that violates a very simple principle in the USA. We have freedom of religion. I don't see you demanding to more female Imams so why do you want power in the Christian church? There are certain denominations that allow female pastors.

Your conclusion is positing that all men objectify women, it's just that some never vocalize it. This is totally wrong as well as very dangerous. This is the same tactics used by the race-baiters. They say that all white people hate blacks and such it's just that only a few of them act on it. This causes deep mistrust between people and completely prevents them from getting along.

Honestly, you've failed to provide any specifics and the few points you gave were to be honest.. pathetic. And by the way, I am writing to you without any regard to your gender. Some men might not think this topic worthy, but in a way your getting equality right now.

 

[Aero]

Aero, when in American history have millions of people ever starved to death simply because there was a lack of food?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Chinese_Famine

Do you think I didn't know that there are poor people in America?

Catch up on some history. Additionally, while some great innovations are based out of China, they are for the most part only good at copying American or other Western technology. In fact they are notorious for stealing other's work. But I bet you don't own a business that manufactures anything in China and you aren't worried about intellectual theft.

Did you know while the whole world was going through the industrial revolution the Chinese were struggling with how to manufacture steel? Why do Chinese people have an economy? Well, we started making all of our goods there because both the men and women don't make any money at all. So American companies sold out the USA and took manufacturing to a place where the workers are paid pennies on the dollar. Most of the expensive houses in LA that are being bought exclusively by Chinese government officials that are setting up their sons and daughters, many from illicit affairs to live in the USA because it sucks so bad in China. Here's a quick documentary on that if you want to learn more.

Did you know that in China you can only have one child? Who in America can't make decisions regarding their own body? Do you really think you are better off in China as a woman?

Pay gap and pay inequality. My take on it is this, in the jobs I have worked I haven't seen it. I have been underpaid and do you know what? I simply left that company and found someone to pay me for my skills. That is how supply and demand works. If you supply something that is worth a certain amount then you can always find demand for it. Further, the evidence is only there for a gender pay gap not a gender wage gap. What that means is that yes, men make more money, but men don't make more money if they have the same educational background, experience and other qualifiers. Some reasons might be...

1. Men disproportionately gravitate towards higher paying occupations in technology and hard sciences (e.g., petroleum engineer).
2. Men disproportionately choose higher-risk, higher paying occupations with greater safety risks for occupational injuries and fatalities (e.g., oil field worker, roofer, and logging).
3. Men are more willing to work outdoors in uncomfortable, physically demanding work environments (construction, oil field workers, commercial fishing, logging).
4. Men are more willing than women to choose demanding, intense jobs where you can’t check out at the end of the work day (e.g., corporate attorney, senior White House staff).
5. Men select jobs with higher pay but with lower personal fulfillment (tax accountant).
6. Men select jobs with higher financial and emotional risks (e.g., venture capitalist).
7. Men are more willing than women to work the worst shifts during the worst hours.
8. Men often choose higher paying subfields (e.g., surgery and anesthesiology).
9. Men are more willing to work in dirty or unpleasant environments with minimal human contact (e.g., prison guard, steel worker, truck drivers).
10. Men work longer hours per week than women on average.
11. Men more frequently than women invest in updating their skills with greater financial payoffs (e.g., master’s degree in computer technology vs. master’s degree in education).
12. Men are more likely than women to have more years of continuous experience in their current occupation.
13. Men are more likely than women to have more years of recent, uninterrupted experience with their current employer.
14. More work more weeks during the year than women, on average.
15. Men are less likely than women to be absent from work (e.g., doctor’s visits, sick days, taking time off when children are sick, etc.).
16. Men are more willing than women to tolerate longer commute times.
17. Men are more willing to relocate, especially to undesirable locations at their company’s request.
18. Men are more willing than women, on average, to travel extensively on the job.
19. Men are more willing than women to take the risk of a variable income, e.g., to be paid by commission vs. a fixed salary.
20. Men often produce more output, e.g., scholarly research articles for university professors.

As for women being CEOs or other very high paying jobs, again this is basic economics. If there was a better woman candidate for a CEO position than a man and the man was still selected then that company is not going to do as well. These people are absolute sharks and if they can make more money with a woman then they will absolutely hire a woman for the CEO position. Politics don't matter to these people, the bottom line is always money.

Are you a Christian? Were you disappointed not to get a position in the Church? Should the state dictate who the church puts into positions of power? This is the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard. Men are in the military because men are stronger and until guns were invented it was very rare to see a female soldier. I want the very best in the military and until women show they are superior fighters then I am glad it's men in charge. To put a female in the military in a high ranking position is to put the military and nation at risk and until you prove that's not the case then keeping men in charge of the military is in the best interest of everyone. You have to prove your ability which men have done time after time. No group has the right to dictate how any religion works, that violates a very simple principle in the USA. We have freedom of religion. I don't see you demanding to more female Imams so why do you want power in the Christian church? There are certain denominations that allow female pastors.

Your conclusion is positing that all men objectify women, it's just that some never vocalize it. This is totally wrong as well as very dangerous. This is the same tactics used by the race-baiters. They say that all white people hate blacks and such it's just that only a few of them act on it. This causes deep mistrust between people and completely prevents them from getting along.

Honestly, you've failed to provide any specifics and the few points you gave were to be honest.. pathetic. And by the way, I am writing to you without any regard to your gender. Some men might not think this topic worthy, but in a way your getting equality right now.

3 paragraphs and a video for a red herring? I think that's some kind of record. Stop making it about China. History lesson not necessary and was never asked for. This is a thread about MGTOW. It's about gender relations. You seem to enjoy dancing around an issue and never really tackling the thing.

When it comes to gender relations there isn't any other good country to compare to. Like their populations are too small. But for the most part women have had their roles designated for them. They aren't sharks as you so eloquently put it. But once again I'm left wondering where you get your information from. Obviously if a man works more hours, or travels further he will make more money. Nobody is talking about merit based pay.

We are talking about a man and woman with the same experience and education and the woman making less. In the same job. This happens all the time, in every single industry. And the intelligent response from people like you is.... be sharks? Do you even wonder why a lot of people are screaming for more socialism? It's because of you primitive minded capitalists.

 

[justjess]

Sigh.. poor and minoriry women hae always worked outside the home. Typcially used in damn near sweat shops or in piece work and paid pittances.

What happened to those home makers or low paid female workers when the man ran off? Or couldnt keep a job? Or died?

What happens to women now with the same circumstances? If they arent allowed to work?

Mass incarceration has decimated millions of mens job prospects as has the war on drugs. What should their women do?

You guys sometimes seem so narrowly focused on some false ideal youve propped up in your minds i feel like you arent dealing with reality.

 

[Glossolalien]

3 paragraphs and a video for a red herring? I think that's some kind of record. Stop making it about China. History lesson not necessary and was never asked for. This is a thread about MGTOW. It's about gender relations. You seem to enjoy dancing around an issue and never really tackling the thing.

When it comes to gender relations there isn't any other good country to compare to. Like their populations are too small. But for the most part women have had their roles designated for them. They aren't sharks as you so eloquently put it. But once again I'm left wondering where you get your information from. Obviously if a man works more hours, or travels further he will make more money. Nobody is talking about merit based pay.

We are talking about a man and woman with the same experience and education and the woman making less. In the same job. This happens all the time, in every single industry. And the intelligent response from people like you is.... be sharks? Do you even wonder why a lot of people are screaming for more socialism? It's because of you primitive minded capitalists.

You made some pretty ignorant statements about capitalism and then when questioned you said we could do it like the Chinese. Men and women actually don't have a wage gap, only a pay gap based on the reasons listed above. That point just went completely over your head.

I never advocated "shark" like behavior. I used that word to describe the board of directors for corporations. You're so intellectually dishonest, you believe you can setup yet another strawman argument despite my post being right there to refute it. If you're going to make an indictment against me, then please make it legitimate. I'm sorry your argument is based on fallacies. I'm sorry that you've been brainwashed into believing what you write. It just makes it look worse when you continue to avoid addressing the statements that I make and then respond to points that I never made and accuse of me of things that are clearly not there.


What is the point of hanging out on a site like this when you repeat verbatim the mainstream nonsense that causes the need for vigilance? This thread is akin to an Antifa meeting or Safespace at a liberal college. There's no discernment and certainly no objective reasoning here.

 

[Aero]

You made some pretty ignorant statements about capitalism and then when questioned you said we could do it like the Chinese.

No. I didn't say that at all. Pretty sure we have already been over this. You were acting like America is the best at everything. Than admitted we let the Chinese steal all our secrets. Hmm interesting.

I never advocated "shark" like behavior.

Lol yes you did. Your whole post can be boiled down into that one statement. Men are more willing to be sharks. I'm not the one deploying the strawman. That is literally your argument. Women aren't shark enough for capitalism.

What is the point of hanging out on a site like this when you repeat verbatim the mainstream nonsense that causes the need for vigilance? This thread is akin to an Antifa meeting or Safespace at a liberal college. There's no discernment and certainly no objective reasoning here.

Now you are just getting hysterical.

 

[justjess]

ive worked upwards of 80 hours a werk from 9am sometimes til 2-3the next morning. Sometimes straight throihh to my next shift start at 9am because of some crisis. And this was on average 1-2 times a week. I NEVER got off at 5pm like i was supposed to, and i was at that job almost 6 years. It was also dangerous work, i got death threats constantly, violent dogs set lose on me and unlike police i was not allowed to have a weapon to protect myself of any sort, not even mace. When we callled the cops to assist they would give us the run around, make us wait hours, or flat out refuse because THEY didnt even want to go into these situations. 90% of my coworkers were female.

My current job doing behavior modification with mentally ill and autistic children sounds like it should be better but many of these kids are very violent and bigger/stronger than me. I have to take classes on blocking assaults and restraint techniques a couple times a year because im not allowed to fight back.. you ever try to restrain an adolescent in the midst of a psychiatri crisis and consumed with rage? One whos heavier then you and stronger then u to begin with? Again this is a profession that overwhelmingly employs females.

Theres a lot of assumptions being made about what women are and arent willong to do, a lot of justifications for paying women less that arent based in reality.

 

[Glossolalien]

No. I didn't say that at all. Pretty sure we have already been over this. You were acting like America is the best at everything. Than admitted we let the Chinese steal all our secrets. Hmm interesting.

Lol yes you did. Your whole post can be boiled down into that one statement. Men are more willing to be sharks. I'm not the one deploying the strawman. That is literally your argument. Women aren't shark enough for capitalism.

Now you are just getting hysterical.

Whoops, you went too far. Now, you're just lying and in a way that suggests a level of intelligence below what a functioning human being is capable of. Thus creating a paradox, with only one solution. Your level of stupidity is such that you're liable to forget to breathe, much less find a way to communicate a message on the internet.

Hopefully the people here not getting paid to spread lies will at least see that you're nothing but a paid troll. You are the worst of the worst by the way. Too incompetent for actual work you lick the dirt off the floor of the elite hoping for a morsel.

 

[Aero]

Whoops, you went too far. Now, you're just lying and in a way that suggests a level of intelligence below what a functioning human being is capable of. Thus creating a paradox, with only one solution. Your level of stupidity is such that you're liable to forget to breathe, much less find a way to communicate a message on the internet.

Hopefully the people here not getting paid to spread lies will at least see that you're nothing but a paid troll. You are the worst of the worst by the way. Too incompetent for actual work you lick the dirt off the floor of the elite hoping for a morsel.

Really? Mr Sharkman over here is going to lecture people on intelligence? At least be a telepathic shark, not just a mindless eating machine. That's what sharks actually do.

A lot of people get frustrated by not being able to prove me wrong. So I wont take it personally and accept your future apology. I have a lot of problems with the cutthroat attitudes of the boardrooms of America. Science has studied these people, and concluded the boardrooms are filled with psychopaths.

It's a question of what behavior we collectively deem as acceptable. And it's not just acceptable to be a shark. The sharks get rewarded the most. If you think that's how intelligent and civilized people behave that's fine. Don't call me intellectually dishonest though. I think that people should be rewarded for their intelligence, ethics and attitude.

Walking on people is the lazy mans game. There's nothing slick about acting without conscious. We should be empowering each other. You know? If women aren't willing to be sharks, than we should teach them to be dolphins. Or an octopus

 

[Glossolalien]

You're latching onto a word that I used and repeating it over and over in a way that I never used it. I described them as sharks in a critical way, and in no way did I advocate or even hint at approval of this behavior.

You're just going to lie some more huh? Not fun to get ousted as paid disinfo agent? I'd be mad too.

You need to change your tactics of you're going to get fired. It's too obvious. The only emotion that you are evoking right now is pity. I suppose some may have pitied Judas too.

 

[Aero]

You're latching onto a word that I used and repeating it over and over in a way that I never used it. I described them as sharks in a critical way, and in no way did I advocate or even hint at approval of this behavior.

You're just going to lie some more huh? Not fun to get ousted as paid disinfo agent? I'd be mad too.

You need to change your tactics of you're going to get fired. It's too obvious. The only emotion that you are evoking right now is pity. I suppose some may have pitied Judas too.

Stop crying straw man. The theme of your previous posts are accurately described by me. You postulate that men are more willing to do certain things. They don't have to all be shark like, but you are essentially repeating the same thing. And pretty sure I never raised any concerns about merit based pay.

On average a woman earns 30% less than what a man does. In the exact same job. Like there are no special circumstances where the woman is unwilling to do something. They just make less, why? Because of systematic discrimination. You asked for the evidence for it. And I gave you like 3 examples that you totally ignored.

I'm not ignoring, or deflecting you. You just don't have good arguments. Woman have had a great struggle for relevance in the work place. We had made a lot of progress but we need to do more. It's the culture we really need to address. The culture of silence, and avoidance.