“Peace to Prosperity”?

justjess

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Interesting observations that go to the heart of the “Israel Question”, @justjess -

The big “if” is that if “sacredness” is to be understood simply in purely sociological terms, what happens when two people lay claim to something with contradictory accounts of who a “sacred” site or territory belongs to? Who gets to say who is right? Perhaps they would be best simply meeting in the middle?

If, on the other hand, there is substance to the notion that God has a future purpose for Israel, the question takes on dimensions beyond the reach of ordinary human negotiations.

I’m sure you can see that depending on their beliefs, one person may come to the question with a very different “if” to another.
Do you really think god wants tens of thousands even hundreds of thousands of people to die for a piece of dirt? The whole thing is nonsensical as far as I’m concerned..

@Thunderian im not disagreeing with you. I’m not even getting into all that because I don’t know enough to have a qualified opinion. All I’m saying is when is enough enough? Trillions of dollars, tens or even hundreds of thousands of lives. For what? we could just stop digging in our heels and end it all if we wanted to.

I’m not sure why ushering in the end times is even a worthy goal.
 






Lisa

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My grandmother's great grand aunt's paternal grand father used to live on that place so, obviously I, who came out centuries later. deserve to live there on the basis of it being promised to my race according to some religious scripture written 2 millenia ago.

-Every pro-israeli ever
It was actually promised to them by God before they even lived there not because someone lived there a couple of centuries before. It was also God who put them back on their land after having removed them centuries ago and they are only still there because that’s where God wants them. People could try to remove them but I wouldn’t try it...
Zechariah 12:3
It will come about in that day that I will make Jerusalem a heavy stone for all the peoples; all who lift it will be severely injured. And all the nations of the earth will be gathered against it.
 






manama

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It was actually promised to them by God before they even lived there not because someone lived there a couple of centuries before. It was also God who put them back on their land after having removed them centuries ago and they are only still there because that’s where God wants them. People could try to remove them but I wouldn’t try it...
Zechariah 12:3
It will come about in that day that I will make Jerusalem a heavy stone for all the peoples; all who lift it will be severely injured. And all the nations of the earth will be gathered against it.
So can i come and live in your house?
 






manama

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Why would you want to come live with me and what does that have to do with my reply?
Oh no no i am not living with you. I am asking to live in your house, as in, i live in it and you get out. It has everything to do with your reply, God made the earth a temporary house for humans, and since its my temporary house and I'm getting bored of my current place, can i come live at your house?
 






Lisa

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Oh no no i am not living with you. I am asking to live in your house, as in, i live in it and you get out. It has everything to do with your reply, God made the earth a temporary house for humans, and since its my temporary house and I'm getting bored of my current place, can i come live at your house?
I am thinking of moving...you could buy my house ;)
He did make the earth for humans to live on...but He has given His chosen people a special place on the earth and said that Jerusalem is His city.
O Lord, in accordance with all Your righteous acts, let now Your anger and Your wrath turn away from Your city Jerusalem, Your holy mountain; for because of our sins and the iniquities of our fathers, Jerusalem and Your people have become a reproach to all those around us.
‭‭DANIEL‬ ‭9:16‬ ‭
 






manama

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I am thinking of moving...you could buy my house ;)
He did make the earth for humans to live on...but He has given His chosen people a special place on the earth and said that Jerusalem is His city.
O Lord, in accordance with all Your righteous acts, let now Your anger and Your wrath turn away from Your city Jerusalem, Your holy mountain; for because of our sins and the iniquities of our fathers, Jerusalem and Your people have become a reproach to all those around us.
‭‭DANIEL‬ ‭9:16‬ ‭
Israelis didn't buy Palestine from Palestinians, i sure don't need to buy your house to live in it.
 






Lisa

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Israelis didn't buy Palestine from Palestinians, i sure don't need to buy your house to live in it.
You’re right...but then again they didn’t have to.They were given that land by God as an everlasting possession. They were taken out of the land to wander in the world and then brought back again into their land in 1948. What a miracle that was! And I’m sure that if the Palestinians or other Arabs/muslims thought that could happen they would really have been living in the land fully to have a better claim, not the hastily pulled together Palestinians that like to protest their land now...

How else would you live in my house?
 






Lisa

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I wonder how the good people of Wyoming would feel if we gave the Jews their land?
The point is, Jess, is that the land the Jews are in now is the land that God gave to them, Wyoming isn’t.
 






manama

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You’re right...but then again they didn’t have to.They were given that land by God as an everlasting possession. They were taken out of the land to wander in the world and then brought back again into their land in 1948. What a miracle that was! And I’m sure that if the Palestinians or other Arabs/muslims thought that could happen they would really have been living in the land fully to have a better claim, not the hastily pulled together Palestinians that like to protest their land now...

How else would you live in my house?
Palestinians or Muslims in general have been in possession far longer than the "special people" have. The difference is that the former conquered it, the latter stole it. The latter is also causing a genocide and the latter will probably burn in hell for eternity for it.
 






manama

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Also the land was given to the children of Israel, not jews in general. And hardly anyone there right now can claim to be from the tribes of Israel.
If being from the "children of Israel" is the requirement to live in the promised land then many of the Afghanistani and South Asian people are direct descendants (and also happen to currently be Muslims) so can they just move there?
 






Lisa

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Palestinians or Muslims in general have been in possession far longer than the "special people" have. The difference is that the former conquered it, the latter stole it. The latter is also causing a genocide and the latter will probably burn in hell for eternity for it.
I don’t see how the latter stole it when it was given to them :rolleyes:

It is the former that is causing genocide...isis anyone? And I gotta say they aren’t gonna get away with it with God. The only way to avoid destruction is to believe on Jesus. As for the latter, God isn’t done with them yet! :)
 






justjess

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The point is, Jess, is that the land the Jews are in now is the land that God gave to them, Wyoming isn’t.
Pretty convenient huh?

A god no one can prove gives away land no one owns to people with no current ties... according to one of the hundred varieties of holy books currently in use
 






Lisa

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Also the land was given to the children of Israel, not jews in general. And hardly anyone there right now can claim to be from the tribes of Israel.
If being from the "children of Israel" is the requirement to live in the promised land then many of the Afghanistani and South Asian people are direct descendants (and also happen to currently be Muslims) so can they just move there?
It is funny how there is doubt as to the actual genealogy of the people living in the land now that call themselves Jews. However, I doubt that God brought non Jews into the land He gave the Israelites. He knows who are His chosen people and He has brought them back into their land that He gave them for an everlasting possession. Being God, He can do what He wants.
 






justjess

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The point is, Jess, is that the land the Jews are in now is the land that God gave to them, Wyoming isn’t.
The point is that we are wasting trillions of dollars and countless precious lives to stubbornly insist that people who believe a particular book own a piece of dirt.

But life is precious right? Isn’t that what pro lovers believe? Doesn’t seem so precious when your willing to kill thousands for stubborness
 






justjess

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It is funny how there is doubt as to the actual genealogy of the people living in the land now that call themselves Jews. However, I doubt that God brought non Jews into the land He gave the Israelites. He knows who are His chosen people and He has brought them back into their land that He gave them for an everlasting possession. Being God, He can do what He wants.
Weren’t the rothschilds pretty fundamental to the whole creation of Israel? Don’t people here swear the royhschilds are either Illuminati or the epitome of evil or whatever other variation of shit is cool at the moment?
 






Lisa

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Pretty convenient huh?

A god no one can prove gives away land no one owns to people with no current ties... according to one of the hundred varieties of holy books currently in use
I don’t know that its convenient but its the reality.

It does take faith to believe, that’s for sure. It takes faith for a lot of things though.
 






Lisa

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The point is that we are wasting trillions of dollars and countless precious lives to stubbornly insist that people who believe a particular book own a piece of dirt.

But life is precious right? Isn’t that what pro lovers believe? Doesn’t seem so precious when your willing to kill thousands for stubborness
We waste trillions of dollars on a lot of other nations who don’t even like us...so what’s your point?

I don’t see thousands being killed for the Jews to live there. I see stubborn people who won’t be happy until they can remove the Jews from Israel completely and who everyday try to hurt, maim and kill them. And for what? They don’t really want that land, they just don’t want the Jews to have it.

Life is precious, you got that right!
 






Lisa

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Weren’t the rothschilds pretty fundamental to the whole creation of Israel? Don’t people here swear the royhschilds are either Illuminati or the epitome of evil or whatever other variation of shit is cool at the moment?
I guess it changes from who you talk to...lots of people here swear the rothchilds are the epitome of evil and others say its just the Jews ruling the world....I think it comes down to your own bias.
 






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