“Magicians” Prove A Spiritual World Exists

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There’s nothing like demons/jinn helping magicians across the globe to get rich and famous. I find it remarkable that David Copperfield likens himself to Jesus Christ and David Blaine, in his near comatose voice, states he has the eye of Horus on the palm of his hand for “protection”.

It’s a long documentary, but I think it’s well worth watching. The comments on YT are also intriguing:

“Magicians” Prove A Spiritual World Exists - Demonic Activity Caught On Video (New Edition)

 






Red Sky at Morning

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There’s nothing like demons/jinn helping magicians across the globe to get rich and famous. I find it remarkable that David Copperfield likens himself to Jesus Christ and David Blaine, in his near comatose voice, states he has the eye of Horus on the palm of his hand for “protection”.

It’s a long documentary, but I think it’s well worth watching. The comments on YT are also intriguing:

“Magicians” Prove A Spiritual World Exists - Demonic Activity Caught On Video (New Edition)

It's interesting that those from a New Age background or even more sinister spiritualities are in little doubt as to the existence of a spirit realm. It appears that they are fed a strange inversion on who the "good guys" and "bad guys" are, but they rarely doubt the reality of spiritual phenomena.
 






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I came across video that's approximately 50 minutes longer than the first one I posted. From the YT description:

"0:00 Intro
5:14 David Copperfield
21:22 Magicians’ Poster Ads With Demons
26:18 Demon Doug Thompson
31:23 Derren Brown
32:57 Hans Klok
33:30 David Blaine
46:41 Aleister Crowley
47:54 Cyril Takayama
53:36 Criss Angel
1:21:39 Jimmy Page/Led Zeppelin's Involvement In Magic & The Occult
1:25:27 Haunted Houses Explained
1:34:38 Franklin Saint
1:36:08 Dynamo
1:58:12 Mike Super and “Desmond”
2:05:06 Mat Franco
2:08:55 Floating Street “Magician”
2:12:52 Shin Lim
2:14:45 Colin Cloud
2:18:18 Chloé Crawford
2:18:54 “Sacred Rianna”
2:19:29 People Openly Sell Their Souls To The Devil
2:26:09 Jibrizy
2:29:54 Oz Pearlman
2:36:16 “Special Head”
2:39:04 Darcy Oake
2:39:30 Ahmed Elbayed
2:39:54 What Does The Bible Say About Magic/Sorcery?
2:46:00 “Magicians”: False Christs Performing False Signs And Wonders
3:06:17 Magic Is A False Religion
This video is an examination of some of the most well-known “magicians” in the world. The video examines many of their “magic” acts. These acts are impossible for a human being to perform without the assistance of a spirit or spirits. The video also shows overwhelming evidence that connects many different "magicians" to demons. The video proves that these "magicians" are really sorcerers who use demonic power to perform their "tricks".
Note: In this video, the term "supernatural" is not used in the strictly theological sense, which would distinguish between the "supernatural" (that which is above nature) and the "preternatural" (that which is beyond nature). Rather, all things that are beyond nature are called "supernatural," as the term would be understood by the majority of people in the culture."

 






Red Sky at Morning

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Experiments with DMT, Ayahuasca and near death experiences all indicate that the reality of a spiritual dimension.

What they don’t do is tell you much about the truthful or deceptive nature of these experiences…

 






Alanantic

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Messages
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Experiments with DMT, Ayahuasca and near death experiences all indicate that the reality of a spiritual dimension.

What they don’t do is tell you much about the truthful or deceptive nature of these experiences…

There's no need to fear such things.
 






DesertRose

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Messages
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A Short read giving the Islamic perspectives on these entities.
Please note that Muslims do not think that Satan is a fallen angel but a Jinn who made it to the level of the angels in heaven. Angels do not have the ability to refuse the Creator they do not have freewill .
For that story:
The World of the Jinn (part 1 of 2)

Throughout history man has always had a deep attraction for the supernatural and the unseen. The existence of a world parallel to our own has always fascinated people. This world is commonly referred to as the spirit world, and almost every set of people have some concept of one. With some people, these spirits are no more then the souls of dead people- or ghosts. With others, spirits are either the forces of good or the forces of evil - both battling against one another to gain influence over humanity. However, both of these explanations are more in tune with folk tales and fantasy. The true explanation of such a world comes from Islam. Like every other way, Islam also claims to explain this realm of the unseen. It is from this realm that Islam explains to us about the world of the Jinn. The Islamic explanation of the Jinn provides us with so many answers to modem day mysteries. Without the knowledge of this world, the Muslims would become like the non-Muslims and be running around looking for any old answer to come their way. So, who or what are the Jinn?
Existence
The Jinn are beings created with free will, living on earth in a world parallel to mankind. The Arabic word Jinn is from the verb ‘Janna’ which means to hide or conceal. Thus, they are physically invisible from man as their description suggests. This invisibility is one of the reasons why some people have denied their existence. However, (as will be seen) the affect which the world of the Jinn has upon our world, is enough to refute this modern denial of one of God’s creation. The origins of the Jinn can be traced from the Quran and the Sunnah. God says:
“Indeed We created man from dried clay of black smooth mud. And We created the Jinn before that from the smokeless flame of fire” (Quran 15:26-27)
Thus the Jinn were created before man. As for their physical origin, then the Prophet, may the mercy and blessings of God be upon him, has confirmed the above verse when he said:
“The Angels were created from light and the Jinn from smokeless fire.” (Saheeh Muslim)
It is this description of the Jinn which tells us so much about them. Because they were created from fire, their nature has generally been fiery and thus their relationship with man has been built upon this. Like humans, they too are required to worship God and follow Islam. Their purpose in life is exactly the same as ours, as God says:
“I did not create the Jinn and mankind except to worship Me.” (Quran 51:56)
Jinns can thus be Muslims or non-Muslims. However, due to their fiery nature the majority of them are non-Muslims. All these non-Muslim Jinns form a part of the army of the most famous Jinn, Satan[1]. Consequently, these disbelieving Jinns are also called devils. Jinns also become Muslims, as they did in the time of the Prophet when a group of them were amazed by the recitation of the Quran. God orders the Prophet to tell the people of this event:
“Say (O’ Muhammed): It has been revealed to me that a group of Jinn listened and said; ‘Indeed we have heard a marvelous Quran. It guides unto righteousness so we have believed in it, and we will never make partners with our lord’.”(Quran 72:1-2)
In many aspects of their world, the Jinn are very similar to us. They eat and drink, they marry, have children and they die. The life span however, is far greater then ours. Like us, they will also be subject to a Final Reckoning by God the Most High. They will be present with mankind on the Day of Judgment and will either go to Paradise or Hell.
Abilities
That which clearly distinguishes the Jinn from mankind, are their powers and abilities. God has given them these powers as a test for them. If they oppress others with them, then they will be held accountable. By knowing of their powers, we can often make sense of much of the mysteries which go on around us. One of the powers of the Jinn, is that they are able to take on any physical form they like. Thus, they can appear as humans, animals trees and anything else. Thousands of people have sighted strange looking creatures all over the world - and it seems more plausible all the sightings of such creatures may have been Jinns parading in different forms.
The ability to possess and take over the minds and bodies of other creatures is also a power which the Jinn have utilized greatly over the centuries. This however, is something which has been prohibited to them as it is a great oppression to possess another being. Human possession is something which has always brought about great attention. But the true knowledge of this subject is rare. Over the last 3 decades the subject of possession has become very commercialized. During the 70’s, films such as The Exorcist and Rosemary’s Baby were used to educate people about possession. However, because such institutions (the film industry) were heavily influenced by Christianity, knowledge of the subject was non-existent. Rather then educate people about Jinn possession, films such as The Exorcist just tended to scare the living daylights out of us!
Only through Islam can we understand such a phenomena. We know as Muslims, that Jinns possess people for many reasons. Sometimes it is because the Jinn or its family has been hurt accidentally. It could be because the Jinn has fallen in love with the person. However, most of the time possession occurs because the Jinn is simply malicious and wicked. For this reason we have been commanded to recite the Quran frequently in our houses as the Prophet said:
“Indeed, Satan flees from the house in which Surah Al-Baqarah (the 2nd chapter of the Quran) is recited.” (Al-Tirmidhi)
If a person does become possessed, then the name of God has to be used in expelling the Jinn. If we look at the practice of the Prophet and his companions, we find many invocations to exorcise the Jinn. All of them invoke God to help the possessed person. How contrary this is to many modern-day exorcists. Many exorcists, often invoke the names of others besides God to exorcise the Jinn. When the Jinn does leave, these people believe that their way was successful. However, this is a ploy of the Jinn, as it knows that if it obeys the exorcist, then it has succeeded in making him worship others besides God. The Jinn often returns when the exorcist leaves, as it knows that nothing except the words of God can stop it from oppressing others.
It is not only humans which are possessed, but also animals, trees and other objects. By doing this, the evil Jinn hope to make people worship others besides God. The possession of idols is one way to do this. Not so long ago the world-wide phenomenon of Hindu idols drinking milk, shocked the world. From Bombay to London, Delhi to California, countless idols were lapping up milk. Ganesh the elephant god, Hanuman the monkey god and even Shiva lingam, the male private organ (!), all seemed to guzzle down the milk as if there was no tomorrow! Unfortunately people were taken in by this and many flocked to feed the Hindu gods. This feat was undoubtedly done by the Jinn as a classic attempt to make people worship false gods.

DR: In this age they have fooled many people into thinking they are aliens.
source and for part 2:
 






Last edited:
Joined
Mar 30, 2017
Messages
1,832
A Short read giving the Islamic perspectives on these entities.
Please note that Muslims do not think that Satan is a fallen angel but a Jinn who made it to the level of the angels in heaven. Angels do not have the ability to refuse the Creator they do not have freewill .
For that story:
The World of the Jinn (part 1 of 2)

Throughout history man has always had a deep attraction for the supernatural and the unseen. The existence of a world parallel to our own has always fascinated people. This world is commonly referred to as the spirit world, and almost every set of people have some concept of one. With some people, these spirits are no more then the souls of dead people- or ghosts. With others, spirits are either the forces of good or the forces of evil - both battling against one another to gain influence over humanity. However, both of these explanations are more in tune with folk tales and fantasy. The true explanation of such a world comes from Islam. Like every other way, Islam also claims to explain this realm of the unseen. It is from this realm that Islam explains to us about the world of the Jinn. The Islamic explanation of the Jinn provides us with so many answers to modem day mysteries. Without the knowledge of this world, the Muslims would become like the non-Muslims and be running around looking for any old answer to come their way. So, who or what are the Jinn?
Existence
The Jinn are beings created with free will, living on earth in a world parallel to mankind. The Arabic word Jinn is from the verb ‘Janna’ which means to hide or conceal. Thus, they are physically invisible from man as their description suggests. This invisibility is one of the reasons why some people have denied their existence. However, (as will be seen) the affect which the world of the Jinn has upon our world, is enough to refute this modern denial of one of God’s creation. The origins of the Jinn can be traced from the Quran and the Sunnah. God says:
“Indeed We created man from dried clay of black smooth mud. And We created the Jinn before that from the smokeless flame of fire” (Quran 15:26-27)
Thus the Jinn were created before man. As for their physical origin, then the Prophet, may the mercy and blessings of God be upon him, has confirmed the above verse when he said:
“The Angels were created from light and the Jinn from smokeless fire.” (Saheeh Muslim)
It is this description of the Jinn which tells us so much about them. Because they were created from fire, their nature has generally been fiery and thus their relationship with man has been built upon this. Like humans, they too are required to worship God and follow Islam. Their purpose in life is exactly the same as ours, as God says:
“I did not create the Jinn and mankind except to worship Me.” (Quran 51:56)
Jinns can thus be Muslims or non-Muslims. However, due to their fiery nature the majority of them are non-Muslims. All these non-Muslim Jinns form a part of the army of the most famous Jinn, Satan[1]. Consequently, these disbelieving Jinns are also called devils. Jinns also become Muslims, as they did in the time of the Prophet when a group of them were amazed by the recitation of the Quran. God orders the Prophet to tell the people of this event:
“Say (O’ Muhammed): It has been revealed to me that a group of Jinn listened and said; ‘Indeed we have heard a marvelous Quran. It guides unto righteousness so we have believed in it, and we will never make partners with our lord’.”(Quran 72:1-2)
In many aspects of their world, the Jinn are very similar to us. They eat and drink, they marry, have children and they die. The life span however, is far greater then ours. Like us, they will also be subject to a Final Reckoning by God the Most High. They will be present with mankind on the Day of Judgment and will either go to Paradise or Hell.
Abilities
That which clearly distinguishes the Jinn from mankind, are their powers and abilities. God has given them these powers as a test for them. If they oppress others with them, then they will be held accountable. By knowing of their powers, we can often make sense of much of the mysteries which go on around us. One of the powers of the Jinn, is that they are able to take on any physical form they like. Thus, they can appear as humans, animals trees and anything else. Thousands of people have sighted strange looking creatures all over the world - and it seems more plausible all the sightings of such creatures may have been Jinns parading in different forms.
The ability to possess and take over the minds and bodies of other creatures is also a power which the Jinn have utilized greatly over the centuries. This however, is something which has been prohibited to them as it is a great oppression to possess another being. Human possession is something which has always brought about great attention. But the true knowledge of this subject is rare. Over the last 3 decades the subject of possession has become very commercialized. During the 70’s, films such as The Exorcist and Rosemary’s Baby were used to educate people about possession. However, because such institutions (the film industry) were heavily influenced by Christianity, knowledge of the subject was non-existent. Rather then educate people about Jinn possession, films such as The Exorcist just tended to scare the living daylights out of us!
Only through Islam can we understand such a phenomena. We know as Muslims, that Jinns possess people for many reasons. Sometimes it is because the Jinn or its family has been hurt accidentally. It could be because the Jinn has fallen in love with the person. However, most of the time possession occurs because the Jinn is simply malicious and wicked. For this reason we have been commanded to recite the Quran frequently in our houses as the Prophet said:
“Indeed, Satan flees from the house in which Surah Al-Baqarah (the 2nd chapter of the Quran) is recited.” (Al-Tirmidhi)
If a person does become possessed, then the name of God has to be used in expelling the Jinn. If we look at the practice of the Prophet and his companions, we find many invocations to exorcise the Jinn. All of them invoke God to help the possessed person. How contrary this is to many modern-day exorcists. Many exorcists, often invoke the names of others besides God to exorcise the Jinn. When the Jinn does leave, these people believe that their way was successful. However, this is a ploy of the Jinn, as it knows that if it obeys the exorcist, then it has succeeded in making him worship others besides God. The Jinn often returns when the exorcist leaves, as it knows that nothing except the words of God can stop it from oppressing others.
It is not only humans which are possessed, but also animals, trees and other objects. By doing this, the evil Jinn hope to make people worship others besides God. The possession of idols is one way to do this. Not so long ago the world-wide phenomenon of Hindu idols drinking milk, shocked the world. From Bombay to London, Delhi to California, countless idols were lapping up milk. Ganesh the elephant god, Hanuman the monkey god and even Shiva lingam, the male private organ (!), all seemed to guzzle down the milk as if there was no tomorrow! Unfortunately people were taken in by this and many flocked to feed the Hindu gods. This feat was undoubtedly done by the Jinn as a classic attempt to make people worship false gods.

DR: In this age they have fooled many people into thinking they are aliens.
source and for part 2:
This was an interesting read, DR! It makes me wonder if the reason why angels are seen as light because that's where the sun is, and jinn are viewed as dark due to the centre of the earth being a ball of fire and where some underground bases are located miles within the earth's lower mantle?

I also read part 2 which was also informative. Here's an excerpt, which explains what we see in the videos:

"Occult Activities of the Jinn
Through their powers of flying and invisibility, the Jinn are the chief component in occult activities. Voodoo, Black magic, Poltergeists, Witchcraft and Mediums can all be explained through the world of the Jinn. Likewise, so can the illusions and feats of magicians. Because the Jinn can traverse huge distances over a matter of seconds, their value to magicians is great. In return for helping them in their magic, the Jinns often ask the magicians to worship them and Satan. Thus the magicians take the Jinn and Satan as lords besides God. In our day, some of the feats performed by magicians and entertainers are without doubt from the assistance of the Jinn. Making the Statue of Liberty disappear, flying across the Grand Canyon and retrieving a ship from the Bermuda Triangle, have all been done by the Jewish magician David Copperfield. There is NO way that a man could do such things without the assistance of the Jinn. It would not be surprising therefore, if David Copperfield had sold his soul to Satan himself."

In the first video, I remember a guy actually yelling at Criss Angel that he's the devil because he made someone disappear and reappear in a matter of seconds.
 






Daze

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Jun 28, 2020
Messages
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There’s nothing like demons/jinn helping magicians across the globe to get rich and famous. I find it remarkable that David Copperfield likens himself to Jesus Christ and David Blaine, in his near comatose voice, states he has the eye of Horus on the palm of his hand for “protection”.

It’s a long documentary, but I think it’s well worth watching. The comments on YT are also intriguing:

“Magicians” Prove A Spiritual World Exists - Demonic Activity Caught On Video (New Edition)

The magicians like to recreate Jesus's miracles in an effort to remove credibility from him. Such as walking on water or turning water into wine. Obviously they do this with the help of djinn.

Theres a youtube channel called Xendruis. Hes been exposing these magicians for years. He gives a lot of examples how these people work with the unseen, without question.

You won't find alot of new content as he's a victim of censorship, but his demon magicians series is still on themtube.

Here's an entire playlist of his work.

 






Joined
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Messages
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The magicians like to recreate Jesus's miracles in an effort to remove credibility from him. Such as walking on water or turning water into wine. Obviously they do this with the help of djinn.

Theres a youtube channel called Xendruis. Hes been exposing these magicians for years. He gives a lot of examples how these people work with the unseen, without question.

You won't find alot of new content as he's a victim of censorship, but his demon magicians series is still on themtube.

Here's an entire playlist of his work.

Interesting channel. I see there's a video with a magician named Justin Florn who gets asked the question if he's a demon. Someone in the comments section got it right. He's not a demon, they assist him with his magic. Some of the stuff I see reminds me of what Jacques Vallée describes in the earlier days when people used to encounter "mythical creatures" such as leprechauns and fairies.
 






Aero

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Mar 13, 2017
Messages
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It's interesting that those from a New Age background or even more sinister spiritualities are in little doubt as to the existence of a spirit realm. It appears that they are fed a strange inversion on who the "good guys" and "bad guys" are, but they rarely doubt the reality of spiritual phenomena.
Who are the good guys?

The inversion you mentioned seems unnecessary when there are few spiritual leaders out there. Especially in America, where the public sphere is dominated by secularists.

I'm sure most of yall get that the occult uses the secularists like the ignorant puppets they are. Nevertheless, it is the secularists that are going to block and gaslight you when you go after the "sinister" spiritualities.
 






Red Sky at Morning

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Who are the good guys?
I guess you go to your definition of goodness and work back from there.

The problem is that good and evil have been either inverted or distorted by culture in the days in which we live, so a lot of people are left groping in the dark, trying to find the light switch…

Acts 17

26And He has made from one [j]blood every nation of men to dwell on all the face of the earth, and has determined their preappointed times and the boundaries of their dwellings, 27so that they should seek the Lord, in the hope that they might grope for Him and find Him, though He is not far from each one of us; 28for in Him we live and move and have our being, as also some of your own poets have said, ‘For we are also His offspring.’
 






AmazingGrace

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A Short read giving the Islamic perspectives on these entities.
Please note that Muslims do not think that Satan is a fallen angel but a Jinn who made it to the level of the angels in heaven. Angels do not have the ability to refuse the Creator they do not have freewill .
For that story:
The World of the Jinn (part 1 of 2)

Throughout history man has always had a deep attraction for the supernatural and the unseen. The existence of a world parallel to our own has always fascinated people. This world is commonly referred to as the spirit world, and almost every set of people have some concept of one. With some people, these spirits are no more then the souls of dead people- or ghosts. With others, spirits are either the forces of good or the forces of evil - both battling against one another to gain influence over humanity. However, both of these explanations are more in tune with folk tales and fantasy. The true explanation of such a world comes from Islam. Like every other way, Islam also claims to explain this realm of the unseen. It is from this realm that Islam explains to us about the world of the Jinn. The Islamic explanation of the Jinn provides us with so many answers to modem day mysteries. Without the knowledge of this world, the Muslims would become like the non-Muslims and be running around looking for any old answer to come their way. So, who or what are the Jinn?
Existence
The Jinn are beings created with free will, living on earth in a world parallel to mankind. The Arabic word Jinn is from the verb ‘Janna’ which means to hide or conceal. Thus, they are physically invisible from man as their description suggests. This invisibility is one of the reasons why some people have denied their existence. However, (as will be seen) the affect which the world of the Jinn has upon our world, is enough to refute this modern denial of one of God’s creation. The origins of the Jinn can be traced from the Quran and the Sunnah. God says:
“Indeed We created man from dried clay of black smooth mud. And We created the Jinn before that from the smokeless flame of fire” (Quran 15:26-27)
Thus the Jinn were created before man. As for their physical origin, then the Prophet, may the mercy and blessings of God be upon him, has confirmed the above verse when he said:
“The Angels were created from light and the Jinn from smokeless fire.” (Saheeh Muslim)
It is this description of the Jinn which tells us so much about them. Because they were created from fire, their nature has generally been fiery and thus their relationship with man has been built upon this. Like humans, they too are required to worship God and follow Islam. Their purpose in life is exactly the same as ours, as God says:
“I did not create the Jinn and mankind except to worship Me.” (Quran 51:56)
Jinns can thus be Muslims or non-Muslims. However, due to their fiery nature the majority of them are non-Muslims. All these non-Muslim Jinns form a part of the army of the most famous Jinn, Satan[1]. Consequently, these disbelieving Jinns are also called devils. Jinns also become Muslims, as they did in the time of the Prophet when a group of them were amazed by the recitation of the Quran. God orders the Prophet to tell the people of this event:
“Say (O’ Muhammed): It has been revealed to me that a group of Jinn listened and said; ‘Indeed we have heard a marvelous Quran. It guides unto righteousness so we have believed in it, and we will never make partners with our lord’.”(Quran 72:1-2)
In many aspects of their world, the Jinn are very similar to us. They eat and drink, they marry, have children and they die. The life span however, is far greater then ours. Like us, they will also be subject to a Final Reckoning by God the Most High. They will be present with mankind on the Day of Judgment and will either go to Paradise or Hell.
Abilities
That which clearly distinguishes the Jinn from mankind, are their powers and abilities. God has given them these powers as a test for them. If they oppress others with them, then they will be held accountable. By knowing of their powers, we can often make sense of much of the mysteries which go on around us. One of the powers of the Jinn, is that they are able to take on any physical form they like. Thus, they can appear as humans, animals trees and anything else. Thousands of people have sighted strange looking creatures all over the world - and it seems more plausible all the sightings of such creatures may have been Jinns parading in different forms.
The ability to possess and take over the minds and bodies of other creatures is also a power which the Jinn have utilized greatly over the centuries. This however, is something which has been prohibited to them as it is a great oppression to possess another being. Human possession is something which has always brought about great attention. But the true knowledge of this subject is rare. Over the last 3 decades the subject of possession has become very commercialized. During the 70’s, films such as The Exorcist and Rosemary’s Baby were used to educate people about possession. However, because such institutions (the film industry) were heavily influenced by Christianity, knowledge of the subject was non-existent. Rather then educate people about Jinn possession, films such as The Exorcist just tended to scare the living daylights out of us!
Only through Islam can we understand such a phenomena. We know as Muslims, that Jinns possess people for many reasons. Sometimes it is because the Jinn or its family has been hurt accidentally. It could be because the Jinn has fallen in love with the person. However, most of the time possession occurs because the Jinn is simply malicious and wicked. For this reason we have been commanded to recite the Quran frequently in our houses as the Prophet said:
“Indeed, Satan flees from the house in which Surah Al-Baqarah (the 2nd chapter of the Quran) is recited.” (Al-Tirmidhi)
If a person does become possessed, then the name of God has to be used in expelling the Jinn. If we look at the practice of the Prophet and his companions, we find many invocations to exorcise the Jinn. All of them invoke God to help the possessed person. How contrary this is to many modern-day exorcists. Many exorcists, often invoke the names of others besides God to exorcise the Jinn. When the Jinn does leave, these people believe that their way was successful. However, this is a ploy of the Jinn, as it knows that if it obeys the exorcist, then it has succeeded in making him worship others besides God. The Jinn often returns when the exorcist leaves, as it knows that nothing except the words of God can stop it from oppressing others.
It is not only humans which are possessed, but also animals, trees and other objects. By doing this, the evil Jinn hope to make people worship others besides God. The possession of idols is one way to do this. Not so long ago the world-wide phenomenon of Hindu idols drinking milk, shocked the world. From Bombay to London, Delhi to California, countless idols were lapping up milk. Ganesh the elephant god, Hanuman the monkey god and even Shiva lingam, the male private organ (!), all seemed to guzzle down the milk as if there was no tomorrow! Unfortunately people were taken in by this and many flocked to feed the Hindu gods. This feat was undoubtedly done by the Jinn as a classic attempt to make people worship false gods.

DR: In this age they have fooled many people into thinking they are aliens.
source and for part 2:
This was really interesting. I suspected Muslims and Christians would have different view on this topic, but didn't expect such a big differences.
I would have an honest question, if I may ask.

Since 4th century our knowledge about outer space, our solar system and space rocks that fly around by us, hugely increased. Many meteor showers are repeated and very accurately predicted events. Do Muslims despite this believe it's angels punishing jinns who try to listen?
 






Last edited:

AmazingGrace

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A little bit on a different note, actors instead of magicians, but when you think about it, they're not that much different. I've heard from several sources that especially Hollywood actors are witches and warlocks who (can) channel spirits when they play a role. That's why some of them are "such a good actors", that they feel like a totally different person in each movie. Depp is probably the best example.
(starts a 3:20)

This is just a thought, but if they really are witches, and IF your whole filming crew could keep secrets, some production costs could be saved on some fighting, flying, telekinesis and similar things, if the actors can do it with "magic", no?
 






DesertRose

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Since 4th century our knowledge about outer space, our solar system and space rocks that fly around by us, hugely increased. Many meteor showers are repeated and very accurately predicted events. Do Muslims despite this believe it's angels punishing jinns who try to listen?
"This does not mean that the stars themselves are pelted at the Satans, nor that the meteorites shoot out only to drive away the Satans, but it means that the countless meteorites which originate from the stars and wander in space at tremendous speeds and which also fall to the earth in a continuous shower prevent the Satans of the earth from ascending to the heavens. Even if they try to ascend heavenward these meteorites drive them away.'"
source: (Tafsir Maudodi)
 






AmazingGrace

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"This does not mean that the stars themselves are pelted at the Satans, nor that the meteorites shoot out only to drive away the Satans, but it means that the countless meteorites which originate from the stars and wander in space at tremendous speeds and which also fall to the earth in a continuous shower prevent the Satans of the earth from ascending to the heavens. Even if they try to ascend heavenward these meteorites drive them away.'"
source: (Tafsir Maudodi)
I've heard about this from non-Muslims and wondered what Muslims think. Since it was mentioned in the part 2 of the article you posted I thought this was a good opportunity to ask. Thank you for answer :)
 






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A little bit on a different note, actors instead of magicians, but when you think about it, they're not that much different. I've heard from several sources that especially Hollywood actors are witches and warlocks who (can) channel spirits when they play a role. That's why some of them are "such a good actors", that they feel like a totally different person in each movie. Depp is probably the best example.
(starts a 3:20)

This is just a thought, but if they really are witches, and IF your whole filming crew could keep secrets, some production costs could be saved on some fighting, flying, telekinesis and similar things, if the actors can do it with "magic", no?
Yes, some but not all. There are some actors and actress who actually do research on the character they're portraying. I do remember when Dustin Hoffman studied for the role of Charlie Babbitt, it was at a psychiatric facility and was quite convincing. Even when he accepted his award for Best Actor for it, you can still see that he was still had the mannerisms and reactions that he developed for the character.

That said, those that "empty themselves" and don't bring anything to the role other than be a vessel for channeling other spirits as Denzel and Johnny have mentioned, that's ominous in my opinion. Also, as an aside, I'm not sure why people were mad at Marlon Brando stating the obvious. Stories are supposed to be fiction. It they weren't, they'd be documentaries. However, perhaps it's just semantics but from my perspective, it's supposed to be entertainment. Maybe people who see it as such are outliers...?
 






Stucky

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The title of the thread reminded me of this from Twin Peaks,

Through the darkness of future past 

The magician longs to see. 

One chants out between two worlds 

Fire walk with me.
 






Nikōn

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The paradox of course is that, especially in terms of western occultism, it is tied not to supernaturalism but rather naturalism and materialism.
From early on in figures like Cornelius Agrippa all the way down to Eliphas Levi, Helena Blavatsky, Aleister Crowley, Anton LaVey and the Chaos Magick movement, is the strong tendency towards naturalistic cosmology rather than supernatural theistic cosmology.
Alongside this it generally coincided with the "enlightenment" era that brought us Modernity and secularism. Both of which have no room for a positive affirmation of the existence of God (or gods, if need be) and the supernatural.

Crowley famously wrote in his preface to the book of demonic magic, the Goetia:

I am not concerned to deny the objective reality of all “magical” phenomena; if they are illusions, they are at least as real as many unquestioned facts of daily life; and, if we follow Herbert Spencer, they are at least evidence of some cause.
Now, this fact is our base. What is the cause of my illusion of seeing a spirit in the triangle of Art. Every smatterer, every expert in psychology, will answer: “That cause lies in your brain.”
English children (pace the Education Act) are taught that the Universe lies in infinite Space; Hindu children, in the Akasa, which is the same thing.
Those Europeans who go a little deeper learn from Fichte, that the phenomenal Universe is the creation of the Ego; Hindus, or Europeans studying under Hindu Gurus, are told, that by Akasa is meant the Chitakasa. The Chitakasa is situated in the “Third Eye,” i.e., in the brain. By assuming higher dimensions of space, we can assimulate this fact to Realism; but we have no need to take so much trouble.
This being true for the ordinary Universe, that all sense-impressions are dependent on changes in the brain,’ we must include illusions, which are after all sense-impressions as much as “realities” are, in the class of “phenomena dependent on brain-changes.”
Magical phenomena, however, come under a special sub-class, since they are willed, and their cause is the series of “real” phenomena called the operations of ceremonial Magic.
These consist of:
(1) Sight: The circle, square, triangle, vessels, lamps, robes, implements, etc.
(2) Sound: The invocations.
(3) Smell: The perfumes.
(4) Taste: The Sacraments.
(5) Touch: As under (1).
(6) Mind: The combination of all these and reflection on their significance.
These unusual impressions, (1-5) produce unusual brain-changes; hence their summary (6) is of unusual kind. Its projection back into the apparently phenomenal world is therefore unusual.
Herein then consists the reality of the operations and effects of ceremonial magic,’ and I conceive that the apology is ample, so far as the “effects” refer only to those phenomena which appear to the magician himself, the appearance of the spirit, his conversation, possible shocks from imprudence, and so on, even to ecstasy on the one hand, and death or madness on the other.
But can any of the effects described in this our book Goetia be obtained, and if so, can you give a rational explanation of the circumstances? Say you so?
I can, and will.
The spirits of the Goetia are portions of the human brain.
Their seals therefore represent (Mr. Spencer’s projected cube) methods of stimulating or regulating those particular spots, (through the eye).
The names of God are vibrations calculated to establish :
(a) General control of the brain. (Establishment of functions relative to the subtle world.)
(b) Control over the brain in detail. (Rank or type of the Spirit.)
(c) Control of one special portion. (Name of the Spirit.)
The perfumes aid this through smell. Usually the perfume will only tend to control a large area; but there is an attribution of perfumes to letters of the alphabet enabling one, by a Qabalistic formula, to spell out the Spirit’s name.
I need not enter into more particular discussion of these points; the intelligent reader can easily fill in what is lacking.



A Satanist person I've conversed with said the following, as it pertains to all of this:

Worth noting is that the cardinal demons in the Ars Goetia come from Agrippa, and the structure of Ars Goetia copies a few Islamic books on the 72 jinn, even borrowing the idea of a brass vessel. So the Ars Goetia serves as a way of merging what are essentially 3 different demonic traditions: Jinni-based sihr, Hermetic spiritism, and that blend of pagan and exorcist material that merely lists a variety of named demons.

All of it is thoroughly fictional and made-up, obviously. If it wasn't, we would only have or need one demonic text. But to approach occultism with a literal belief in spirits is silly. Minds cannot exist without a physical form, and we have known that for over a hundred years now. This discounts God as anything more than a useful metaphor, as it can be reduced to in some forms of monism like Scientific Pantheism.

Nonetheless, these demons still have utility! Crowley describes them as representing specific archetypes to be contacted for help with self-reflection and to divine answers or insight into certain topics. Anton LaVey describes the four crown princes also as archetypes, but in his rituals they are used to symbolize specific states of mind or emotion that the individual casts out through psychodrama.

In psychological models of chaos magick, which are the most advanced and are the only ones that have demonstrated an ability to repeat their results, we see this sort of symbolism used in a wider array of applications. Many of the ways that chaos sigils and servitors are used can extend to demons, too.

All of this has grown out of the original rituals of demon summoning with roots in the Ganzfeld Effect caused by staring into cave darkness, the hallucinatory effects often exacerbated by sleep deprivation, fasting, and the use of poisonous and psychoactive incenses. These effects are easily reproduced with a black divination mirror, or doing the ritual in a dark, candlelit room, which most grimoires call for.

We just understand what's actually going on in the rituals a lot better now, and so we can focus on what they're good at instead of wasting our time with superstitions about going invisible or controlling the weather or whatever. This also allows us to discard a lot of the supposed "necessities" of ritual given in the Ars Goetia, which are really little more than a collection of apophenic connections and ritual implements brought about through multi-generational operant conditioning.


This allows us to refine our use of the Ars Goetia greatly beyond what those in the past used and interpreted it as. In fact, the basics of ritual trance combined with the Ganzfeld Effect can be used to work with pretty much any character you could come up with, but the Ars Goetia conveniently divides demons by planetary (and therefore also elemental) archetypes which come a lot more handy in generating self-insight because they have a much more vague character to them and balance each other out due to being a system born out of generations of delving into that part of the human psyche.

I don't condone their views but the worldviews of magicians are usually far less supernatural than your average theist. If anything it shows the dissonance between belief and (mystical) experience to me.
 






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