Sufism and Mysticism

Sam

Sam

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Well, there is an awakening movement based on it which is interesting for me.
There are some great Sufi people in the history e.g. Rumi or Shah Nimatullah Wali that had accurate predictions.
I have heard that he had even predicted the Australia's bushfire in this poem:

اول دود از جهان برآید
دنیا پس از آن بسی نپاید

It would be great if someone knows more...
 
Wigi

Wigi

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Sam said:
Hello all,

Does anyone know about Sufism here?
Click to expand...
Could you present the beliefs of sufis?
Some say they are muslims others say they are hindus or apostates. It's pretty hard to know who's right.
 
Helioform

Helioform

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Wigi

Wigi

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Helioform said:

Qabalah, Freemasonry, the Tijaniyah Order, the Muslim Brotherhood, Al-Qaeda, and Sufism - The Secret Doctrine of the Assassins. An Occult Religion behind an Islamist fascad - 9/11

The Sufis are the main 'mystical' manifestation of Islam. Although its acceptability to orthodox Muslims has always been essential to the function of Sufism as an 'Inner Tradition' within Islam, there remains speculation that its origins lie in much older near-eastern mystical traditions...
freemasonrywatch.org
Click to expand...
Thanks, that's the rabbit hole I was looking for. Fascinating content there.
 
Helioform

Helioform

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Wigi said:
Thanks, that's the rabbit hole I was looking for. Fascinating content there.
Click to expand...
I recommend the entire www.freemasonrywatch.org website. It led me to a greater understanding of what freemasonry actually is. Amazing that it is still up, but I remember a time when the site has been taken down by masons who physically stepped in the room holding the computers and actually removed them. This was told to me by the website's webmaster through email...
 
Infinityloop

Infinityloop

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Helioform said:
I recommend the entire www.freemasonrywatch.org website. It led me to a greater understanding of what freemasonry actually is. Amazing that it is still up, but I remember a time when the site has been taken down by masons who physically stepped in the room holding the computers and actually removed them. This was told to me by the website's webmaster through email...
Click to expand...
I don't think Freemasons would take that site seriously, it's too juvenile combined with lots of fantasy fiction.
 
Infinityloop

Infinityloop

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Wigi said:
Could you present the beliefs of sufis?
Click to expand...
True Sufism follows the Qur'an and Sunnah of Prophet Muhammad (a.s.). They are not a sect, only a path within Islam. Most Sufis are Sunnis.

Wigi said:
others say they are hindus or apostates. It's pretty hard to know who's right.
Click to expand...
Salafis often say absurd things like that, but no orthodox Muslim would, generally speaking. Of course every community has their bad apples, whether Sufism, Orthodox Christianity, Judaism or Theravada Buddhism. You cannot generalize with these topics, you have to specify what form of Sufism etc.

If you want a good Biblical analogy, Sufism is like a living embodiment of the spirit of Psalms of David in the Old Testament.
 
Infinityloop

Infinityloop

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Helioform said:
You don't know what you're talking about...
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If I didn't I would not have said anything. Your site is pareidolia, plain and simple, and as I already said, it's juvenile.
Your article was also incredibly inaccurate, fun, but inaccurate. Also, incredibly lacking in subtlety and subtext. A hodgepodge without much comprehension or foreknoweldge of what it's even trying to say. Also, the things mentioned in the title of the article isn't even explored in the article, lol.
I have come across that site, and article, before though and merely found it amusing. None of these subjects are new to me, I'm widely read. I don't give any credence to superstitious hearsay.
 
Helioform

Helioform

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Infinityloop said:
If I didn't I would not have said anything. Your site is pareidolia, plain and simple, and as I already said, it's juvenile.
Your article was also incredibly inaccurate, fun, but inaccurate. Also, incredibly lacking in subtlety and subtext. A hodgepodge without much comprehension or foreknoweldge of what it's even trying to say. Also, the things mentioned in the title of the article isn't even explored in the article, lol.
I have come across that site, and article, before though and merely found it amusing. None of these subjects are new to me, I'm widely read. I don't give any credence to superstitious hearsay.
Click to expand...
In other words you are clueless. Thanks for clarifying.
 
AspiringSoul

AspiringSoul

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Personal attacks are not allowed. Next offense will result in a ban.
Helioform said:

Qabalah, Freemasonry, the Tijaniyah Order, the Muslim Brotherhood, Al-Qaeda, and Sufism - The Secret Doctrine of the Assassins. An Occult Religion behind an Islamist fascad - 9/11

The Sufis are the main 'mystical' manifestation of Islam. Although its acceptability to orthodox Muslims has always been essential to the function of Sufism as an 'Inner Tradition' within Islam, there remains speculation that its origins lie in much older near-eastern mystical traditions...
freemasonrywatch.org
Click to expand...
wtf?? you daft twat.

1) al qaeeda? al qaeeda are wahabi salafi, they oppose sufism and believe in murdering them.
2) assassins, they're a group of ismaili shias.they have no connection to sufis (who are sunni orthodox) and salafi (extremist literalist sunni and who reject esoteric/metaphysical ideas).
3) it says

Unlike Christianity, ceremonial magic has a legitimate place in Islam. According to Islamic law, sihr-al-halal or pemitted magick may be used as a vehicle for religious discovery.

all magic is, is the use of mental or metaphysical means to alter/affect the physical.

"the power of apparently influencing events by using mysterious or supernatural forces. "

so for example, if a person was to recite the Quran or the names of Allah to acheive an experience/vision pertaining to a topic in islam...that technically is 'magic' in a sense.
if a person prays to God, that too is a form of magic.
At this stage the word 'magic' is misconstrued to mean something far more sinister eg
The practice of demonic magic (summoning and binding demons) has a central role in the magick of both traditions. This doesn't sit easily with modern Sufis, who like to stress the more image-friendly "spiritual development" side of their tradition. Nevertheless, demonic magick is probably one of the most ancient threads in the Sufi tapestry,

sorry, summoning/binding jinnaat is STRICTLY FORBIDDEN in islam. They have free will like humans, we're not allowed to bother them.
IN FACT..the world of demons pertains to the lower brain region ie the amygdala. people dominated by the lower brain regions are people who lack self control..and islam tellsus to control the nafs, to bring it under control. The lower brain region corresponds to our genetic/biological past, eg amphibian/reptilian...and hence the type of imagery that appears in any type of inner experience for people dominated by this part of the brain, is demonic. The sufis like aziz nasafi described it as 'full of serpent like demons'
this world...is the lowest part of 'malakut' (the mind) and it is considered hell...it is not a place to go to..a place a muslim should want to see.
However if a person can control his own mind, through 'reason' (which implies he is a person of self control and dominant over his nafs/carnal nature) then the jinn world comes to him in more human like form (the neo cortex basically)...and in turn they are receptive and respectful to humans..and come to the aid of humans, but there is no 'summoning/binding' involved, rather it is about mutual respect because the type of beings and world seen in that state is more angelic.
Even then it is not going to be a perfect experience due to the fact we humans are constantly shifting.

YET sufism looks down on the nafs, whilst islam makes room for it, sufism aspires to the state of ihsan, which brings the the ego to death, as in like the New testament/Jesus talked about. it is about dissolving the 'self' into the universal/true 'self'

4) you are a priest forever after the ORDER OF MELKEZEDEK*
ORDER...that is what a sufi tariqah is, an order.

dating back to the ancient Canaanite/Babylonian/Egyptian cultures
muslims believe the true religion was given to every nation..and therefore even the babylonians, canaanites, egyptians, indians, persians, chinese, all had the truth as corrupted it.
so if they turned pagan, they were no different to the jews who also turned pagan.
you cannot use their fallen position as evidence that anything coming from there was false.
time, the weeks, months, calendars are based on babylonian astrology.there's a lot we use that came from there.

5) authentic qabballah is quite brilliant, the sephirot are a metaphysical map of the Self. i learnt quite a lot through that...and it explained cerain things i needed to know and feel everyone should know.
where it came from, i dont know.
however the dark side of 'qabballah' is due to abuse of the metaphysical map..and that comes from the 'tree of death' system, not the tree of life.
even qabballah openly warns against evil and they officially condemn those 'type' of qabballah practioners.
i have no connection to qabballah other thanr eading wikipedia and a couple of websites to gain some insight on the metaphysical, that is all.
it's like we all have an etheric body...but its nice to know how different religions/groups/spiritual traditions view that...for a more rounded understanding.

6)
"...Legend has it that Mohammed's son-in-law Sidina 'Ali, the ideal warrior, once became so caught up in the frenzy of killing that he began to kill his own people after finishing off the enemy. His frenzy had to be cooled down before he could stop."

wtf?
you guys love to make shit up and make it as evil as possible.
no there is zero truth to this and it completely goes against islam..in fact it is complete kufr..and a muslim who kills a muslim is a kafir. furthermore, an ideal soldier has self control.

7) ismailis are not even considered true muslims by sunnis. have you seen who they follow today? aga khan, aka playboy.
they're not even proper muslims.
as for their origins, they used to kill sunni muslims, hardly a part of us.

8)
'Assasseen' in Arabic signifies 'guardians', and some commentators have considered this to be the true origin of the word: 'guardians of the secrets'."
another case of making shit up
the word comes from Hashish..because they smoked the stuff.

9)
Islam is not a messianic religion and has no room for a saviour-messiah. Nevertheless, there gradually developed--probably under Christian influence--the notion of an eschatological restorer of the faith, identified as a descendant of the Prophet or as the returning 'Isa (i.e., Jesus).

quite literally he is called MASIH ISA and we believe in the second coming. I suppose a saviour God is better than saviour messiah who in his own words said 'the son can do NOTHING on his own, except by the Father'
derp

10)
in my merciful opinion, dumb fucks like you should have your heads caved in, out of mercy to the rest of us...but this forum is full of dumb fucks like you.
 
AspiringSoul

AspiringSoul

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rumi was sunni hanafi.
what he wrote in A particular state of consciousness is not to be taken literally.
 
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