Comparison of JAHtruth's "The way home or face the Fire" to the bible

[The Sojourner]

Well it didn't because it says in Revelation it happened after Jesus ascended. Not going back and forth with this stupidity again.

Then you are disagreeing with Christ and what He said, and not with me. As for me, I'll stick with what He says happened (Father Willing).

And so should you.

 

[JoChris]

There are reportedly over 3000 denominations today that call themselves "Christian", including Roman Catholicism and the Protestant denominations to which she gave birth. Christ refers to Roman Catholicism as "the Great Whore" and to the Protestant denominations as harlots, referring to all of them as abominations (Rev. 17).


Like many man-made titles on Earth, it is intentionally deceptive, using Christ's Name to SELL their man-made traditions and doctrines (many shall come in my name and deceive many...) instead of sharing Christ's True Teachings.


Because they don't actually put their trust in God, nor believe Christ-Jesus. Saying and doing are two very different things. A very simple example of this is how you read a direct quote from Christ-Jesus plainly stating that His Father is greater than all, including "I" (Father is greater than Christ) and yet you come along and try to con people into believing that Christ really meant "equal to", e.g. with your butchered translation of Philippians 2:6, or the John 1:1 eisegesis, etc.

The Hebrew word "Satan" means "The Opposer" (God's Adversary). Those who do the exact opposite of what Christ actually says are very obviously listening to and obeying the Opposer, regardless of whatever name they choose to call themselves.


Roman Catholicism was the only form of "Christianity" in all of "Christendom" for roughly 1200 years, before the Protestant Reformation. The Protestants, who themselves were Roman Catholics, protested against the "mother church", demanding it reform itself because its teachings were overtly pagan (pagan holidays of Christ-mass (Babylonian Saturnalia/Yuletide), Ishtar/Easter (the Babylonian godess of fertility), Babylonian Sun-day sun-worship, the Babylonian "trinity" doctrine, the Babylonian marketing and selling of indulgences, etc.). Sadly, all protestantism ultimately did was create new franchises in the "Christian" doctrine industry, all of which adopted some or most of the same pagan, Babylonian traditions, customs and beliefs, along with their superstitions, rites and rituals.

NONE of those things have anything to do with Christ. They are abominations which Christ hates. And yet "Christians" are expecting to be rewarded for blindly teaching each other all of these things instead of studying and DOING as Christ COMMANDS: i.e. keep The Law/Commandments of God and DO His Will.

That issue is discussed later in TWHOFTF as well.

 

[JoChris]

I see that @A Freeman claimed that AJH's religion is true Christianity. If that is true AJH will have kept paganism completely out of his new religion, including his "The way home or face the face" book.

See what the bible says about being unequally yoked with unbelievers:

2 Corinthians 6:14 Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers: for what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness? and what communion hath light with darkness?
15 And what concord hath Christ with Belial? or what part hath he that believeth with an infidel?
16 And what agreement hath the temple of God with idols? for ye are the temple of the living God; as God hath said, I will dwell in them, and walk in them; and I will be their God, and they shall be my people.
17 Wherefore come out from among them, and be ye separate, saith the Lord, and touch not the unclean thing; and I will receive you.
18 And will be a Father unto you, and ye shall be my sons and daughters, saith the Lord Almighty.

unequally yoked, what does it mean? CARM

The term “unequally yoked” is found 2 Cor. 6:14 in the KJV and the ESV. Basically, it deals with a Christian being joined together with unbelievers in an ungodly way. This should be avoided. The term comes from ancient biblical times where two oxen would be joined together with a yoke. The yoke was the wooden piece that went around their necks so they could be teamed up and controlled. If one ox was weaker than the other, then they were unequally yoked and would not perform well together.

In the context of Paul’s writing, it appears that Paul was dealing with the paganism found in the Corinthian area. He says in the following verses, “Or what harmony has Christ with Belial or what has a believer in common with an unbeliever? 16 or what agreement has a temple of God with idols?” (2 Cor. 6:15-16). Belial was a very negative term.

-

 

[JoChris]

2:15 At any given moment in time, a soul would need to be (and is) exactly where it has earned the right to be, by all its previous actions and thoughts, in eternal-time, and for the circumstances to change, to coincide with what was deserved. This would teach and encourage the good, and punish the evil, so that those who opened their spiritual-eyes and sought to, would be able to make sense of their lives: past; present and future. This would then encourage child-like (not childish) faith and trust, in God and doing His Will, leading to even more dependence and closeness to Him, and yet more faith, until they came to KNOW and love Him.

That is a very generalised statement following on from previous verses.

--
2:16 This is perfectly symbolized by the ancient Roman’s symbol of the mirror, for Venus, their goddess of love. The mirror reflects exactly what is shown to it....

Why is a self-professed Jesus reborn (i.e. reincarnated) quoting pagan mythology as if it is a good thing?

The goddess was not exactly a virtuous woman of good christian character. She most certainly broke the "thou shalt not commit adultery" commandment!

Venus (/ˈviːnəs/)[a] is a Roman goddess, whose functions encompass love, beauty, desire, sex, fertility, prosperity, and victory. In Roman mythology, she was the ancestor of the Roman people through her son, Aeneas, who survived the fall of Troy and fled to Italy. Julius Caesar claimed her as his ancestor. Venus was central to many religious festivals, and was revered in Roman religion under numerous cult titles.

Venus (mythology) - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

From a pagan-friendly website Facts and mythology about the goddess Venus

... Today, she is mainly known as the goddess of love, but in the era of the Roman Empire she held many responsibilities including desire, lust, victory, and prostitution.
In the story of her birth, Venus’ father Uranus was castrated by his son, Cronus. Cronus was handed a stone sickle by his mother, Gala, who told her son to attack Uranus. After castrating his father, Cronus threw his reproductive organs into the sea, which caused the water to foam and helped create Venus.....

Venus’ amorous attributes were reflected among her worshipers. For example, a temple to Venus/Aphrodite was located in the Grecian city of Corinth. The phrase “to Corinthianize” came to mean “to practice immorality,” as sensual activities were a part of the worship of Venus in her temple on the Acrocorinthus hill. Lifestyles in Corinth were rife with “licentiousness (meaning sexually unrestrained behavior) and wanton luxury.”....

..and so does God, the Ruler of Venus (Morning Star), in faith; good and evil.

the Christian God is ruler over everything.

Matthew 11:25
At that time Jesus answered and said, I thank thee, O Father, Lord of heaven and earth...


Colossians 1:16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:
17 And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.

 

[JoChris]

The following "verses" sound similar to Word of Faith's false doctrines but it is way more extreme.

2:17 If a soul gives 5% faith to God, He repays it with 5%, and so on, up to 100% faith, receiving 100% repayment from God. This faith in the unseen and the magic [?!!!!], of having personal miracles, which were previously thought to be only coincidences, having the effect of an ADDICTIVE drug, that HEALS absolutely everything, with NO ill effects. The addiction increases the child-like faith, and the destruction of self-ishness, until 100% faith is achieved, along with a spiritual joy (lasting, unlike human fragile and therefore very temporary happiness) that no-one can take away from you (if you have it), and a “cup that runs over” (total fulfillment - no emptiness - so full of the healing “Light” and Love, that you cannot help but overflow towards others, wanting to share the experience with them, because it is so wonderful).

I do not remember reading any Christian/ pseudo-Christian saying "faith in unseen and the magic" as if they approve of it before!!!!

Same for promising what sounds like guaranteed spiritual ecstasy if a person has enough faith.
I have heard Charismatics promising "joy in the Spirit" if we truly walk in the Spirit but AJH takes it way beyond that!!!!

2:18 God, being the answer to every question, and the cure for every ill, is the ONLY thing that every SOUL needs, because with God, a soul has EVERYTHING it NEEDS (God being the source and supply of “Light” and everything good - Matt. 6:33 & Luke 12:31). God is the best friend that any soul can ever have (for ever), and He is with you 24 hours a day, wherever you go.

Where is this said in the BIBLE [paraphrased]?

"If you believe in God, in this life you will get every question answered, every cure, every problem solved.... 100% GUARANTEED!"

That is the Word of Faith's health, wealth and prosperity doctrine, commonly known as the "name it and claim it" or "blab it and grab it"....

with God answering every question telepathically on top of that.

2:19 No human friend can be with you 24 hours a day, every day, everywhere you go. Your human friends can not protect you from the Devil, and really, they are all bad, whereas God is good and the Ruler of the Universe, the most powerful “Force” in the whole of creation. What an amazing friend to have!

Anthony John Hill's promise that God will be your magic genie in every way imaginable - including being your constant advisor and companion - would be SO spiritually seductive to hurting lonely people, especially those feeling powerless and uncertain.

 

[lightseeker]

and so does God, the Ruler of Venus (Morning Star),

All you need to know about AJH's religion

 

[ToxicFemininitySucks]

Apologies for the little threadjack...

Christ clearly taught His disciples about reincarnation, and it appears they understood the lesson.

Matthew 17:10-13
17:10 And his disciples asked him, saying, Why then say the scribes (lawyers) that Elias must first come?
17:11 And Jesus answered and said unto them, Elias truly shall first come, and restore all things.
17:12 But I say unto you, That Elias is come already, and they knew him not, but have done unto him whatsoever they listed. Likewise shall also the Son of Man suffer of them.
17:13 Then the disciples understood that he spoke unto them of John the Baptist (Elias - Elisha NOT Elijah).

These verses explain that John the Baptist was the reincarnation of Elisha, as evidenced by the mantle being given to Elisha by Elijah at the Jordan, and then being returned to Elijah (Christ – see John 3:13 and 2 kings 2:11) when Elias/Elisha (John the Baptist) baptized Christ in the Jordan (2 Kings 2:13-14, Matt. 3:16-17).

Elias is NOT Elisha, he is Elijah.
Elisha is referred to in the new testament as Eliseus (Lk 4:27)

In context:

24And he said, Verily I say unto you, No prophet is accepted in his own country. 25But I tell you of a truth, many widows were in Israel in the days of Elias, when the heaven was shut up three years and six months, when great famine was throughout all the land; 26But unto none of them was Elias sent, save unto Sarepta, a city of Sidon, unto a woman that was a widow.

27And many lepers were in Israel in the time of Eliseus the prophet; and none of them was cleansed, saving Naaman the Syrian.

The events mentioned in vs25-26, about Elias/Elijah, are from 1Kings 17-18

The event mentioned in vs27, about Eliseus/Elisha are from 2Kings 5

I took the time to check the king of kings to see if the verses match, and it correctly identifies the person of vs25-26 as Elijah and vs27 as Elisha

I'm not going to accuse you of willfully lying and will take it as an honest mistake, but if jah or yourself is incorrect about this matter what does that say about the rest of your doctrine?

Roman Catholicism was the only form of "Christianity" in all of "Christendom" for roughly 1200 years, before the Protestant Reformation. The Protestants, who themselves were Roman Catholics, protested against the "mother church", demanding it reform itself because its teachings were overtly pagan (pagan holidays of Christ-mass (Babylonian Saturnalia/Yuletide), Ishtar/Easter (the Babylonian godess of fertility), Babylonian Sun-day sun-worship

Well, before the printing press was well established, every time someone read the Bible for himself and realized that there were errors in catholic teaching it was very easy for the catholic church to silence him ... doesn't mean that all of the "protestant " - as if all protestants believe exactly the same things - ideas barely came about at the reformation.

The fact that any record actually survives of many of these pre-reformation dissenters - all "heretics" according to wikipedia - serves as proof that no, it wasn't just the catholic church. (And, in my personal opinion, the fact that the reformation age men are called "reformers" but pre-reformation age men are "heretics" is suspicious in it's own right. But that's probably a discussion suited better for another thread...)

 

[A Freeman]

Apologies for the little threadjack...




Elias is NOT Elisha, he is Elijah.
Elisha is referred to in the new testament as Eliseus (Lk 4:27)

In context:

24And he said, Verily I say unto you, No prophet is accepted in his own country. 25But I tell you of a truth, many widows were in Israel in the days of Elias, when the heaven was shut up three years and six months, when great famine was throughout all the land; 26But unto none of them was Elias sent, save unto Sarepta, a city of Sidon, unto a woman that was a widow.

27And many lepers were in Israel in the time of Eliseus the prophet; and none of them was cleansed, saving Naaman the Syrian.

The events mentioned in vs25-26, about Elias/Elijah, are from 1Kings 17-18

The event mentioned in vs27, about Eliseus/Elisha are from 2Kings 5

I took the time to check the king of kings to see if the verses match, and it correctly identifies the person of vs25-26 as Elijah and vs27 as Elisha

I'm not going to accuse you of willfully lying and will take it as an honest mistake, but if jah or yourself is incorrect about this matter what does that say about the rest of your doctrine?


Well, before the printing press was well established, every time someone read the Bible for himself and realized that there were errors in catholic teaching it was very easy for the catholic church to silence him ... doesn't mean that all of the "protestant " - as if all protestants believe exactly the same things - ideas barely came about at the reformation.

The fact that any record actually survives of many of these pre-reformation dissenters - all "heretics" according to wikipedia - serves as proof that no, it wasn't just the catholic church. (And, in my personal opinion, the fact that the reformation age men are called "reformers" but pre-reformation age men are "heretics" is suspicious in it's own right. But that's probably a discussion suited better for another thread...)

John 1:19-21
1:19 And this is the record of John, when the Jews sent priests and Levites from Jerusalem to ask him, Who art thou?
1:20 And he confessed, and denied not; but confessed, I am not the Christ.
1:21 And they asked him, What then? Art thou Elijah? And he saith, I am not. Art thou that prophet? And he answered, No.

 

[elsbet's cat ^. .^]

Pay careful attention... to care for
the church of God, which he obtained
with his own blood.
Acts 20:28​

It isn't just what AJH adds or blends... the absence of the Gospel should not be overlooked.

Indeed, Jo.
This is the heart of the matter.

The Absence of the Gospel is the best identifier of false prophets, and the common denominator in all false doctrines.

For a minute, I thought the thread had taken a detour from Jahtruth, straight into Ellen White's theology. The overlap between Jahtruth and the SDA is significant.

According to Ellen White, Jesus was promoted to a position of equality with God... but like AJH, they don't believe He is God.

The man Christ Jesus
was not the Lord God Almighty
- Ellen White • LINK​

Soo...
Eternal life is off the table for them both.

↓​

If Christ isn't God-- He can't save you.

Truly no man can ransom another,​

or give to God the price of his life -​

Psalm 49:7-9​

That includes His time on earth, as well. There is no way around it.

. . .

Subtil
Meanwhile, per the SDAs, Jesus has been in the heavenly sanctuary for the past 2000 years, charged with the gruesome task of shedding His own blood, repeatedly, on people's individual confessions, as they are made-- that is, one by one, in real time.

It is false, of course. We know He doesn't offer himself repeatedly-- if so, he would have had to suffer repeatedly since the foundation of the world. Heb. 9

Am I the only one who thinks this sounds like the fantastical (fanatical) musings of an enemy?

. . .​

I'm so far behind in this thread, I'm putting the rest in a spoiler, for now.

Spoiler: ONCE... FOR ALL

'He entered once for all into the holy places... by means of his own blood, thus securing an eternal redemption. And, 'as it is, he has appeared once for all at the end of the ages to put away sin by the sacrifice of himself --> offered once to bear the sins of many.'

That is just from Hebrews 9.
We find it again in Hebrews 7 and 1 Peter 3:18 and Jude 1:3... and etc.

--> Tetelestai... it is finished-- and that was over 2000 years ago. John 19:26-30, 17:4

. . .​

The Law isn't in dispute... only its power.

We're dead to the law...
Dead means dead-- to become wholly alienated from a thing; freed from all connection with it.

... in order to serve in the newness of the Spirit.
Serve, in this context, means "absolutely, to yield obedience; to relinquish one's right to self-govern to God. Romans 7

It isn't debatable, anyway. : )
Either you believe it is true or you don't... and for the record, I hope they do. Soon.

. . .
​

@The Sojourner said:
In addition to founding three churches, and the call as Senior Pastor of First Presbyterian Church, Chattanooga, Dr. Milton is a retired Army Chaplain (Colonel). He is the recipient of the Legion of Merit. Milton has also served as chancellor and president of seminaries and is the author of more than thirty books.

@The Sojourner said:
So, do you contend that they must be lying too?

Sorry... if they must be lying?

According to JAHTruth, this man is a Deceiver.
He said Churches are EVIL creations of Satan, which exist only for the purpose of deception --> and this man has founded, not one-- but three churches, in his career.

"No wonder Christ said only hypocrites​

and heathens go to church, to be seen​

by others." LINK​

​

It is Lucifer/Satan/Iblis who has built ALL of the other temples on Earth, aka churches, synagogues... which is why God does NOT dwell there, in any of them (Acts 7:48; 17:24), and has warned us they have all been put up BY DECEPTION, and that we should NEVER set foot inside of them--

Do you really think it would be wise to believe a word this man has said, in light of his rampant church-founding?

If so, on what merit? Other than the fact he may agree with JAHTruth on a particular matter, of course.

*​

 

[elsbet's cat ^. .^]

Well it didn't because it says in Revelation it happened after Jesus ascended. Not going back and forth with this stupidity again.

I also thought it was understood-- TIME applies to earth; eternity applies to Heaven. : )


If someone has already addressed this-- sorry. :/

@The Sojourner said:

The answer is that Satan / The Red Dragon / Lucifer and his angels were defeated and cast down to the Earth a long time ago, when the war in heaven took place, before the beginning (Genesis), as has been explained in TWHOFTF for everyone's benefit.

Satan still had access to Heaven in the first chapter of Job.

Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the​

LORD, and Satan also came among them.​

The LORD said to Satan, “From where have​

you come?”​

​

Satan answered the LORD and said,​

“From going to and fro on the earth,​

and from walking up and down on it.”​

​

And the LORD said to Satan, “Have you considered my servant Job..."​

It is apparent he was not on earth during this conversation. If he was, he might have been more specific-- I was in Philly...

 

[The Sojourner]

I also thought it was understood-- TIME applies to earth; eternity applies to Heaven. : )


If someone has already addressed this-- sorry. :/

@The Sojourner said:

Satan still had access to Heaven in the first chapter of Job.

Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the​

LORD, and Satan also came among them.​

The LORD said to Satan, “From where have​

you come?”​

​

Satan answered the LORD and said,​

“From going to and fro on the earth,​

and from walking up and down on it.”​

​

And the LORD said to Satan, “Have you considered my servant Job..."​

It is apparent he was not on earth during this conversation. If he was, he might have been more specific-- I was in Philly...

Satan did not obey the LORD when commanded to submit to human limitations in order to learn to be good like the rest of us did:

Sura
7:11. It is We Who created you and gave you shape; then We bade the (fallen) angels submit to Adam, and you submitted (Luke 9:55); not so Iblis (Lucifer); he refused to be of you who submitted.
7:12. ("I AM") said: "What prevented thee from submitting when I commanded thee?" He said: "I am better than he: Thou didst create me from fire (energy), and him from clay."
7:13. ("I AM") said: "Get thee down from this: it is not for thee to be arrogant here: get out, for thou art of the meanest (of creatures)."
7:14. He said: "Give me respite till The Day they are raised up."
7:15. ("I AM") said: "Be thou among those who have respite."
7:16. He said: "Because thou hast thrown me out of The Way, lo! I will lie in wait for them on Thy Straight Way:
7:17. Then will I assault them from before them and behind them, from their right and their left: nor wilt Thou find, in MOST of them, gratitude (for Thy mercies)."
7:18. ("I AM") said: "Get out from this, disgraced and expelled. If any of them follow thee,- Hell-Fire will I fill with you all (Matt. 8:22).
7:19. O Adam! Dwell thou and thy wife in The Garden, and enjoy (its good things) as ye wish: but approach not this tree (of the knowledge of Evil [lies]), or ye run into harm and transgression."
7:20. Then began Satan to whisper suggestions to them, bringing openly before their minds all their shame that was hidden from them (before): he said: "Your Lord only forbade you this tree, lest ye should become angels or such beings as live for ever."
7:21. And he swore to them both (the lie), that he was their sincere adviser.
7:22. So by deceit he brought about their fall: when they tasted of the tree (of his knowledge which is not Knowledge but only lies), their shame became manifest to them, and they began to sew together the leaves of The Garden over their bodies. And their Lord called unto them: "Did I not forbid you that tree, and tell you that Satan was an avowed enemy unto you?"
7:23. They said: "Our Lord! We have wronged our own souls: if Thou forgive us not and bestow not upon us Thy Mercy, we shall certainly be lost."
7:24. ("I AM") said: "Get ye down, with enmity between yourselves. On Earth will be your dwelling-place and your means of livelihood,- for a time."
7:25. He said: "Therein shall ye live, and therein shall ye die; but from it shall ye be taken out (at last)."
7:26. O ye Children of Adam! We have bestowed clothing upon you to cover your shame, as well as to be an adornment to you. But being clothed with righteousness,- that is the best. Such are among the Signs of "I AM", that they may receive warning!

Satan was cast out of heaven and then after that, tempted the first woman, Eve.

Satan showed up in heaven again later, when the assembly of angels was called for them to appear before the LORD, and there the LORD asked Satan if he had considered His servant Job.

When asked by the LORD where he had come from, he said that he had come from the Earth. That again shows that Satan had already been cast out of heaven, to the earth, before that point (Satan was no longer living in heaven like the other angels were, but was on the earth, before the assembly of angels was called).

When Adam and Eve were in the Garden, Satan was already there with them, (before Job was born) to tempt them, like he swore that he would do, to deceive and to assault them, as it is written in Sura 7:16-17.

 

[The Sojourner]

If Christ isn't God-- He can't save you.

Truly no man can ransom another,or give to God the price of his life -Psalm 49:7-9
That includes His time on earth, as well. There is no way around it.

​

Quoting the Psalm in context, shows that that statement was not correct:

49:6 They that trust in their wealth, and boast themselves in the multitude of their riches;
49:7 None [of them] can by any means redeem his brother, nor give to God a ransom for him:

So that was making a wrong assumption, based on an out of context misquote.

 

[The Sojourner]

Sorry... if they must be lying?

According to JAHTruth, this man is a Deceiver.
He said Churches are EVIL creations of Satan, which exist only for the purpose of deception --> and this man has founded, not one-- but three churches, in his career.

"No wonder Christ said only hypocritesand heathens go to church, to be seenby others." LINK

It was posted to point out that he agrees (as does the rest of Christianity overall) that Revelation contains History (Rev.12-14), because that is what a thorough study of the Bible shows.

So if you don't agree with us, and you don't agree with Jesus (and what He stated in Luke), and you don't agree with Christianity, then who do you agree with? Since it's not Jesus, Christianity, or us (or the Bible for that matter).

Luke 10:18 And he said unto them, I beheld Satan as lightning fall from heaven (Rev. 12:9).

Satan has been on the earth since the time of Adam and Eve (the snake in the Garden).

Are you making up your own personal doctrine, to fit your own beliefs and what feels comfortable for you, rather than believing in what the Bible teaches?

 

[JoChris]

Satan did not obey the LORD when commanded to submit to human limitations in order to learn to be good like the rest of us did:

Sura
7:11. It is We Who created you and gave you shape; then We bade the (fallen) angels submit to Adam, and you submitted (Luke 9:55); not so Iblis (Lucifer); he refused to be of you who submitted.
7:12. ("I AM") said: "What prevented thee from submitting when I commanded thee?" He said: "I am better than he: Thou didst create me from fire (energy), and him from clay."
7:13. ("I AM") said: "Get thee down from this: it is not for thee to be arrogant here: get out, for thou art of the meanest (of creatures)."
7:14. He said: "Give me respite till The Day they are raised up."
7:15. ("I AM") said: "Be thou among those who have respite."
7:16. He said: "Because thou hast thrown me out of The Way, lo! I will lie in wait for them on Thy Straight Way:
7:17. Then will I assault them from before them and behind them, from their right and their left: nor wilt Thou find, in MOST of them, gratitude (for Thy mercies)."
7:18. ("I AM") said: "Get out from this, disgraced and expelled. If any of them follow thee,- Hell-Fire will I fill with you all (Matt. 8:22).
7:19. O Adam! Dwell thou and thy wife in The Garden, and enjoy (its good things) as ye wish: but approach not this tree (of the knowledge of Evil [lies]), or ye run into harm and transgression."
7:20. Then began Satan to whisper suggestions to them, bringing openly before their minds all their shame that was hidden from them (before): he said: "Your Lord only forbade you this tree, lest ye should become angels or such beings as live for ever."
7:21. And he swore to them both (the lie), that he was their sincere adviser.
7:22. So by deceit he brought about their fall: when they tasted of the tree (of his knowledge which is not Knowledge but only lies), their shame became manifest to them, and they began to sew together the leaves of The Garden over their bodies. And their Lord called unto them: "Did I not forbid you that tree, and tell you that Satan was an avowed enemy unto you?"
7:23. They said: "Our Lord! We have wronged our own souls: if Thou forgive us not and bestow not upon us Thy Mercy, we shall certainly be lost."
7:24. ("I AM") said: "Get ye down, with enmity between yourselves. On Earth will be your dwelling-place and your means of livelihood,- for a time."
7:25. He said: "Therein shall ye live, and therein shall ye die; but from it shall ye be taken out (at last)."
7:26. O ye Children of Adam! We have bestowed clothing upon you to cover your shame, as well as to be an adornment to you. But being clothed with righteousness,- that is the best. Such are among the Signs of "I AM", that they may receive warning!

Satan was cast out of heaven and then after that, tempted the first woman, Eve.

Satan showed up in heaven again later, when the assembly of angels was called for them to appear before the LORD, and there the LORD asked Satan if he had considered His servant Job.

When asked by the LORD where he had come from, he said that he had come from the Earth. That again shows that Satan had already been cast out of heaven, to the earth, before that point (Satan was no longer living in heaven like the other angels were, but was on the earth, before the assembly of angels was called).

When Adam and Eve were in the Garden, Satan was already there with them, (before Job was born) to tempt them, like he swore that he would do, to deceive and to assault them, as it is written in Sura 7:16-17.

The sura is in the Quran.
It is not in the Christian bible.

 

[A Freeman]

The sura is in the Quran.
It is not in the Christian bible.

The Bible doesn't belong to the "Christians" any more than the Quran belongs to the "Muslims".

The Word of God is HIS Gift to all of mankind, in every form. And every Spiritual-Being cherishes the Truth contained therein because it is SPIRITUAL/ETERNAL and it is LIFE (John 6:63).

 

[lightseeker]

2:15 At any given moment in time, a soul would need to be (and is) exactly where it has earned the right to be, by all its previous actions and thoughts, in eternal-time, and for the circumstances to change, to coincide with what was deserved. This would teach and encourage the good, and punish the evil, so that those who opened their spiritual-eyes and sought to, would be able to make sense of their lives: past; present and future. This would then encourage child-like (not childish) faith and trust, in God and doing His Will, leading to even more dependence and closeness to Him, and yet more faith, until they came to KNOW and love Him.

That is a very generalised statement following on from previous verses.

--
2:16 This is perfectly symbolized by the ancient Roman’s symbol of the mirror, for Venus, their goddess of love. The mirror reflects exactly what is shown to it....

Why is a self-professed Jesus reborn (i.e. reincarnated) quoting pagan mythology as if it is a good thing?

The goddess was not exactly a virtuous woman of good christian character. She most certainly broke the "thou shalt not commit adultery" commandment!

Venus (/ˈviːnəs/)[a] is a Roman goddess, whose functions encompass love, beauty, desire, sex, fertility, prosperity, and victory. In Roman mythology, she was the ancestor of the Roman people through her son, Aeneas, who survived the fall of Troy and fled to Italy. Julius Caesar claimed her as his ancestor. Venus was central to many religious festivals, and was revered in Roman religion under numerous cult titles.

Venus (mythology) - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

From a pagan-friendly website Facts and mythology about the goddess Venus

... Today, she is mainly known as the goddess of love, but in the era of the Roman Empire she held many responsibilities including desire, lust, victory, and prostitution.
In the story of her birth, Venus’ father Uranus was castrated by his son, Cronus. Cronus was handed a stone sickle by his mother, Gala, who told her son to attack Uranus. After castrating his father, Cronus threw his reproductive organs into the sea, which caused the water to foam and helped create Venus.....

Venus’ amorous attributes were reflected among her worshipers. For example, a temple to Venus/Aphrodite was located in the Grecian city of Corinth. The phrase “to Corinthianize” came to mean “to practice immorality,” as sensual activities were a part of the worship of Venus in her temple on the Acrocorinthus hill. Lifestyles in Corinth were rife with “licentiousness (meaning sexually unrestrained behavior) and wanton luxury.”....

..and so does God, the Ruler of Venus (Morning Star), in faith; good and evil.

the Christian God is ruler over everything.

Matthew 11:25
At that time Jesus answered and said, I thank thee, O Father, Lord of heaven and earth...


Colossians 1:16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:
17 And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.

No answer to any of this (or any of the previous passages for that matter) from jah truthers. They’re basically just trying to distract from their book now by carrying on silly arguments, they’d rather talk about anything but their religious book it seems

 

[lightseeker]

It was posted to point out that he agrees (as does the rest of Christianity overall) that Revelation contains History (Rev.12-14), because that is what a thorough study of the Bible shows.

So if you don't agree with us, and you don't agree with Jesus (and what He stated in Luke), and you don't agree with Christianity, then who do you agree with? Since it's not Jesus, Christianity, or us (or the Bible for that matter).

Luke 10:18 And he said unto them, I beheld Satan as lightning fall from heaven (Rev. 12:9).

Satan has been on the earth since the time of Adam and Eve (the snake in the Garden).

Are you making up your own personal doctrine, to fit your own beliefs and what feels comfortable for you, rather than believing in what the Bible teaches?

So post what this guy means by “histories“ since you are appealing to him as an authority. all you’ve shown is he used the word. Surely this Presbyterian minister means exactly what you do by it.

 

[Red Sky at Morning]

So post what this guy means by “histories“ since you are appealing to him as an authority. all you’ve shown is he used the word. Surely this Presbyterian minister means exactly what you do by it.

It has been my depressing experience to realise that if someone doesn’t want to understand, they don’t! Sometimes it takes a change of heart to change a head.

 

[The Sojourner]

No answer to any of this (or any of the previous passages for that matter) from jah truthers. They’re basically just trying to distract from their book now by carrying on silly arguments, they’d rather talk about anything but their religious book it seems

It says in the beginning of the Book that you should ask the Lord to interpret it for you.

So post what this guy means by “histories“ since you are appealing to him as an authority. all you’ve shown is he used the word. Surely this Presbyterian minister means exactly what you do by it.

I've already posted from the article of what he said previously.

Some Christians believe that the Rev. 12 war in heaven happens at the end of time. However, that view does not offer an explaintion how Satan came to be in the Garden of Eden to tempt and mislead Adam and Eve, nor does it hold up with Christ's Testimony that He beheld Satan fall like lightning from heaven (Luke 10:18).

Definition of beheld - past tense of behold

 

[Awoken2]

Here is a visual summary of A Freeman's contribution, influence, aspirations and general effect on this forum as to date.