Are black lives at risk? Not by the police or any other race.

[Hermes]

Explain!

Slavery, Jim crow, lack of educational and social resources in black communities, no generational wealth, war on drugs and systematic destruction of black families, negative stereotypes, promotion of negative black images, destruction of black history.... If you truly care look up any of this to start. To discuss it all would take a book but I mentioned some of it in the other thread.

 

[Artful Revealer]

Slavery, Jim crow, lack of educational and social resources in black communities, no generational wealth, war on drugs and systematic destruction of black families, negative stereotypes, promotion of negative black images, destruction of black history.... If you truly care look up any of this to start. To discuss it all would take a book but I mentioned some of it in the other thread.

I want you to rationalize your reason for calling me a white supremacist.

 

[Hermes]

You are a white supremacist when you don't follow their lies and manipulations and you come with objective facts.

When a white man commits a crime against a black, this is a situation that requires the destruction of the history of whites. Vice versa (although much more than the other), somehow we have to take that lying down.

We are asked to see them as a group without a criminal capacity. We should see them as/like ill-bred children (totally wrong and racist thought). But we should also recognize their political leadership. You cannot be both criminally insane(this is your opinion) and leader. You have to choose one.

Being an impotent group that needs help and being a group that wants to overthrow the regime and become a leader are very different things. It can't be both at the same time.

Follow lies and manipulation? Says the guy relying on the FBI for his stats and data. You haven't provided much objective facts just painted a narrative with whatever stats you could find to fit your world view.

Like I mentioned police are responsible for reporting their own use of force data and even then its not mandatory but voluntary. Would they honestly be honest about any of this?

 

[Hermes]

I want you to rationalize your reason for calling me a white supremacist.

It's not one statement art it's your body of work that shows it.

For instance in the other thread you finally started to talk about what you feel is a solution to black crime which you tied to culture and being immoral. What is your culture and your morality more superior? Do you even know what black culture is?

This thread alone you're going off to support your race based conclusions on police use of force by relying on data from the police. Are you all that fucking dumb? When did we all start trusting the government on data or is just convenient to trust it when it suits a narrative? I've shown clearly that it's not mandatory for cops to report use of force data. What makes you believe they're being honest?

The more you speak you can see you have no empathy to learn the other side because you're ingrained in this belief that the white man is being left behind. No wonder you're a God damn Trump supporter. There's a reason I don't spend much time here anymore. Rather focus on my own growth then this bs.

 

[thursdayafternoon]

they were IMPRISONING black men for drugs while on the other end they were financing the drug cartels who were moving the drugs.

If some drug cartels can, blacks can too? Even if we accept that the state doesn't treat all criminals equally, there is no way to defend people who sell poison. Drugs are responsible for the deaths of tens of thousands of people in the USA every year. Much more than deaths, it's also responsible for ruined lives and families. If you don't deal with poison, you won't be arrested, it's that simple.

You are trying to decriminalize drugs. No way. I don't even discuss it.

 

[justjess]

If some drug cartels can, blacks can too? Even if we accept that the state doesn't treat all criminals equally, there is no way to defend people who sell poison. Drugs are responsible for the deaths of tens of thousands of people in the USA every year. Much more than deaths, it's also responsible for ruined lives and families. If you don't deal with poison, you won't be arrested, it's that simple.

You are trying to decriminalize drugs. No way. I don't even discuss it.

The United States government flooded black communities with those drugs. On purpose. So they could justify mass imprisonment and destroy their budding communities in one fell sweep. Slavery moved to the prison blocks. Why are prisoners in NY manufacturing hand sanitizer among other things for $1/hr. Prisoners in California putting out forest fires? Why do we have private prisons that require full capacity to make a profit?

You want to blame anyone for the drugs ravaging this country and destroying families... blame the government. Why the hell are we in the Middle East guarding poppy fields for the last twenty years? Don’t you find it funny the opiate epidemic kicked off around the same time? I already linked you to the info on the governments role in the crack epidemic. Open your eyes. Your “enemy” was created and spoon fed to you for a purpose. Your falling for it, hook like and sinker.

 

[Hermes]

If some drug cartels can, blacks can too? Even if we accept that the state doesn't treat all criminals equally, there is no way to defend people who sell poison. Drugs are responsible for the deaths of tens of thousands of people in the USA every year. Much more than deaths, it's also responsible for ruined lives and families. If you don't deal with poison, you won't be arrested, it's that simple.

You are trying to decriminalize drugs. No way. I don't even discuss it.

There's your problem. Anyone who has worked with people with substance abuse issues knows that policing this is not the cure to the problem. Legalization is a more controlled solution because it allows for regulated use of these drugs and it could better allow healthcare workers to focus on treatment for those that need it.

I'm in Canada and when we legalized cannabis a lot of consultation was done with the communities, health experts and researchers. I think it's been working super well for us here.

We need a similar systematic approach to regulating other drugs. It's stupid to police adults for behaviours that they choose to carry out. Who are you to impose your morality as a means to incarcerate people? But the war on drugs will never end because then the prison industrial complex will be destroyed.

 

[thursdayafternoon]

When did we all start trusting the government on data or is just convenient to trust it when it suits a narrative? I've shown clearly that it's not mandatory for cops to report use of force data. What makes you believe they're being honest?

Is it controversial from which race someone is? or is it controversial why someone was arrested?

For example, in 4778 murder, do you suspect that murderers are not black? Or isn't the deceased really dead? There is no opposition to this data other than you. You may not trust the state or the police, but you must have evidence when opposing.

 

[KoncreteMind]

If some drug cartels can, blacks can too? Even if we accept that the state doesn't treat all criminals equally, there is no way to defend people who sell poison. Drugs are responsible for the deaths of tens of thousands of people in the USA every year. Much more than deaths, it's also responsible for ruined lives and families. If you don't deal with poison, you won't be arrested, it's that simple.

You are trying to decriminalize drugs. No way. I don't even discuss it.

Jess answered it better than I would have but I'll just add that you're sidestepping the issue. My point was that Reagan's ADVISOR'S quote shows that their PLAN was to destabilize the black community which would effectively lead to the results you see today. Yet you can see him say that was the plan and still on the back end look at black people and say "why didnt you overcome it anyways?"?

And I said the gov't supported drug cartels while on the other end incarcerating black people who used drugs. Do you see the hypocrisy? Would a parent give his child dessert before dinner and then punish the child for eating dessert before dinner? How can law enforcement bankroll drug cartels while at the same time punishing recipients of the drug cartels product?

 

[thursdayafternoon]

Jess answered it better than I would have but I'll just add that you're sidestepping the issue. My point was that Reagan's ADVISOR'S quote shows that their PLAN was to destabilize the black community which would effectively lead to the results you see today. Yet you can see him say that was the plan and still on the back end look at black people and say "why didnt you overcome it anyways?"?

And I said the gov't supported drug cartels while on the other end incarcerating black people who used drugs. Do you see the hypocrisy? Would a parent give his child dessert before dinner and then punish the child for eating dessert before dinner? How can law enforcement bankroll drug cartels while at the same time punishing recipients of the drug cartels product?

jess is a fake news source. Although she admitted that she was wrong, she still didn't delete her posts.

My point was that Reagan's ADVISOR'S quote shows that their PLAN was to destabilize the black community which would effectively lead to the results you see today.

I answered that here.

We are asked to see them as a group without a criminal capacity. We should see them as/like ill-bred children (totally wrong and racist thought). But we should also recognize their political leadership. You cannot be both criminally insane(this is your opinion) and leader. You have to choose one.

Being an impotent group that needs help and being a group that wants to overthrow the regime and become a leader are very different things. It can't be both at the same time.

if you are unstable, if you are impotent, if you are an injured, failed child who needs help, you cannot be a proud political actor who talks about changing the regime of the country at the same time. You cannot be both a patient in rehabilitation and a self-determined revolutionary.

 

[thursdayafternoon]

There's your problem. Anyone who has worked with people with substance abuse issues knows that policing this is not the cure to the problem. Legalization is a more controlled solution because it allows for regulated use of these drugs and it could better allow healthcare workers to focus on treatment for those that need it.

I'm in Canada and when we legalized cannabis a lot of consultation was done with the communities, health experts and researchers. I think it's been working super well for us here.

We need a similar systematic approach to regulating other drugs. It's stupid to police adults for behaviours that they choose to carry out. Who are you to impose your morality as a means to incarcerate people? But the war on drugs will never end because then the prison industrial complex will be destroyed.

Black lives matter but black lives dying of drugs are "no matter"? ok.

 

[justjess]

jess is a fake news source. Although she admitted that she was wrong, she still didn't delete her posts.

I answered that here.

if you are unstable, if you are impotent, if you are an injured, failed child who needs help, you cannot be a proud political actor who talks about changing the regime of the country at the same time. You cannot be both a patient in rehabilitation and a self-determined revolutionary.

If your going to link to that conversation please also concede that you were wrong since your stats show unarmed no risk black people arE 120% more likely to be killed by the police then unarmed no risk white people. Thanks.

 

[Hermes]

Is it controversial from which race someone is? or is it controversial why someone was arrested?

For example, in 4778 murder, do you suspect that murderers are not black? Or isn't the deceased really dead? There is no opposition to this data other than you. You may not trust the state or the police, but you must have evidence when opposing.

No one has said black crime rates are not an issue. Have I not stated this a million times. The point is we are talking about police brutality and police use of force... Is that not what all of this is about?

You have yet to show that police only kill violent criminals because that's not true.

 

[Hermes]

Black lives matter but black lives dying of drugs are "no matter"? ok.

Do you have reading comprehension issues? Did I say black lives should die of drugs?

Legalizing drugs does not necessarily mean we are green lighting deaths. Legalizing drugs allows us to better shape drug use policies from a public health perspective not from a perspective of criminalization. Drug addicts shouldn't be sent to jail but should receive treatment. Legalization or decriminalization would be a step towards working on this.

 

[KoncreteMind]

jess is a fake news source. Although she admitted that she was wrong, she still didn't delete her posts.

Isnt that the commendable thing to do? Admit she was wrong, and dont try to go back and change her posts as if she wasnt? Im not sure what you're exposing here

I answered that here.

if you are unstable, if you are impotent, if you are an injured, failed child who needs help, you cannot be a proud political actor who talks about changing the regime of the country at the same time. You cannot be both a patient in rehabilitation and a self-determined revolutionary.

No Im not asking you about black people or their reaction. The quote I posted shows there was a plan to destabilize black people and all you can do is come at the back end and point at them and say they shouldnt have let the plan become successful?

You complain about crime, yet when its shown that the same ones "enforcing" the crime on one end were bankrolling crime on the other side, you say nothing? If you dont like something, you dont like something. But dont try and create fictitious reasons for not liking something as a cover...

 

[Artful Revealer]

There's a reason I don't spend much time here anymore. Rather focus on my own growth then this bs.

Yeah, I've had the same long-term dropouts on this latest forum edition. Too many intellectual cowards and hypocrites preferring to ride the hate train against whites and thinking they're anti-racists as if we're living in the 1920s.

 

[thursdayafternoon]

No one has said black crime rates are not an issue. Have I not stated this a million times. The point is we are talking about police brutality and police use of force... Is that not what all of this is about?

You have yet to show that police only kill violent criminals because that's not true.

I have discussed them many times in this thread. I won't repeat.

Do you have reading comprehension issues? Did I say black lives should die of drugs?

Legalizing drugs does not necessarily mean we are green lighting deaths. Legalizing drugs allows us to better shape drug use policies from a public health perspective not from a perspective of criminalization. Drug addicts shouldn't be sent to jail but should receive treatment. Legalization or decriminalization would be a step towards working on this.

They should go to jail before they are rehabilitated. Using drugs shouldn't only result in a holiday in the hospital for a while. They are a burden to the state and the public. People who use drugs commit much more crime and have much more health problems. the public or law doesn't have to tolerate this. Judicial system must act as a deterrent to this. You can't prevent crime by pampering it.

Isnt that the commendable thing to do? Admit she was wrong, and dont try to go back and change her posts as if she wasnt? Im not sure what you're exposing here

No Im not asking you about black people or their reaction. The quote I posted shows there was a plan to destabilize black people and all you can do is come at the back end and point at them and say they shouldnt have let the plan become successful?

You complain about crime, yet when its shown that the same ones "enforcing" the crime on one end were bankrolling crime on the other side, you say nothing? If you dont like something, you dont like something. But dont try and create fictitious reasons for not liking something as a cover...

the state's committing crime and enforcing people to commit crime is not just about blacks.

my question is this: black people don't have a criminal capacity? should we see black people as "children pushed to crime"? if so, they cannot be a dominant force in politics. they can't make a revolution. you have no political rights without your criminal capacity. if we will look at the problem from this perspective, first, we have to eliminate the narrative of blm-style organizations.

 

[KoncreteMind]

.

my question is this: black people don't have a criminal capacity? should we see black people as "children pushed to crime"? if so, they cannot be a dominant force in politics. they can't make a revolution. you have no political rights without your criminal capacity. if we will look at the problem from this perspective, first, we have to eliminate the narrative of blm-style organizations.

But my question is if there was a CLEAR plan to destabilize the black community, then why are you complaining when that plan was successful? The results you see today are here by design. Yet you wont address that....

Of course everyone has a capacity to commit crime. The question is why was there a PLAN to destabilize the black community? Why was the gov't on one end bankrolling drug cartels while on the other end locking up drug users/drug dealers in their country? If its about "drugs" and "poisons" why wouldnt we NOT be bankrolling cartels? But you wont address that either.

All you're trying to do is make up reasons for your dislike thats most likely been passed down to you from the generations before you..

 

[thursdayafternoon]

But my question is if there was a CLEAR plan to destabilize the black community, then why are you complaining when that plan was successful? The results you see today are here by design. Yet you wont address that....

Of course everyone has a capacity to commit crime. The question is why was there a PLAN to destabilize the black community? Why was the gov't on one end bankrolling drug cartels while on the other end locking up drug users/drug dealers in their country? If its about "drugs" and "poisons" why wouldnt we NOT be bankrolling cartels? But you wont address that either.

All you're trying to do is make up reasons for your dislike thats most likely been passed down to you from the generations before you..

I don't know about the claim that the black community is destabilized. I just comment it by saying "even if so". I will read if you have articles and evidence. Except Ehrlichman, he's not an article, it's just a conspiracy. I'm showing the proofs of my own claims. You should show too

All you're trying to do is make up reasons for your dislike thats most likely been passed down to you from the generations before you..

Don't direct the discussion to personal charges. I'm tired of racism charges and implications. I don't have to prove I'm not racist.

According to you, Larry Elder and Candace Owens are black people who don't like blacks.

Political correctness is the worst disease.

 

[KoncreteMind]

I don't know about the claim that the black community is destabilized. I just comment it by saying "even if so". I will read if you have articles and evidence. Except Ehrlichman, he's not an article, it's just a conspiracy. I'm showing the proofs of my own claims. You should show too

You're in here complaining about large amounts of crime coming from their community right? Thats destabilizing. Incarceration rate? Destabilized. No fathers in the home? Destabilized. You wanna say they're lazy, only accept gov't handouts, dont like work etc...? Destabilized.

I gave you the plan straight from the horses mouth. An advisor to the president is as close to a source as you can get and he said the plan was to disrupt the black community by arresting their leaders. They were successful and all you can do is complain about what black people are or are not doing? Why dont you have anything to say about the plan itself?

Don't direct the discussion to personal charges. I'm tired of racism charges and implications. I don't have to prove I'm not racist.

According to you, Larry Elder and Candace Owens are black people who don't like blacks.

Political correctness is the worst disease.

Of course its going to go there though. You complain about crime but when your gov't is literally bankrolling it on one end, while locking people up for it on the other, you have nothing to say.

And I actually agree with Candace Owens from time to time. The difference is your side of the fence uses her as a mascot as if to say "this black person says what I do too!". Go look at the people who post her here. Thats all they do is use her as a mascot to say what they want to say but feel wont be accepted or validated...