Christian Zionism Discussed

Karlysymon

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Iam moving your posts here so as not to derail the other (Law of Moses) thread.
Tokiel said:
since June 7 1967 Christianity has been on a downward slope of apostate corruption as God's focus is now on the Jews in Israel.
God was mad at them for not obeying His laws and killing His prophets.

Any day now God will pour out His spirit upon the Jews and they will finally be able to see who their Messiah is... which will cause a national repentance in Israel.
Iam curious, does this "focus on jews" or "national repentance" apply to those in the diaspora or only those currently residing in Israel because...
More Israelis Left Israel Than Moved Back in Six Year Record
16,700 left and 8,500 came back in 2015, in first year since 2009 that more Israelis exited than returned.

If you argue that all Jews (whether atheists of adherents of Judaism) around the world will have to move back to Israel, when do you suppose that will happen and the scriptures to back up your position?

I suppose in light of that, there's this ongoing push to get people around the world to perform aliyah to maintain the numbers.
 

TokiEl

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Iam moving your posts here so as not to derail the other (Law of Moses) thread.

Iam curious, does this "focus on jews" or "national repentance" apply to those in the diaspora or only those currently residing in Israel because...
More Israelis Left Israel Than Moved Back in Six Year Record
16,700 left and 8,500 came back in 2015, in first year since 2009 that more Israelis exited than returned.

If you argue that all Jews (whether atheists of adherents of Judaism) around the world will have to move back to Israel, when do you suppose that will happen and the scriptures to back up your position?

I suppose in light of that, there's this ongoing push to get people around the world to perform aliyah to maintain the numbers.
The Holy land belongs to the Holy one of Israel... who has brought back His people just as He said He would.

The true stewards of that land are back... but the squatters don't respect that and put up a fight.

Imagine going on a long vacation and when you come home you find your house occupied by squatters who put up a fight for the right to live in your house... and that is the situation in Israel.


In Zechariah 12:10-14 it is the house of David and the inhabitants of Jerusalem whom God pours out His spirit on so they see and mourn for their Messiah.
 

Karlysymon

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Follow Israel's example and re-draw the world based on racist or at least ultra-nationalist lines?

This -needless to say controversial- logic, the equating of white nationalism with traditional Zionism, was expressed by "white nationalist" policy wonk, Richard Spencer, to the reportedly speechless (in response) Rabbi Matt Rosenberg at Texas A&M in December of 2016:

"The Rabbi asked Spencer: "My tradition teaches a message of radical inclusion and love. Will you sit town and learn Torah with me, and learn love?", Forward.com reported. But the alt-right leader [Spencer] instead took the opportunity to compare Zionism to white nationalism, and suggested Jewish people were unwilling to assimilate with different cultures. Spencer told Rosenberg: "Do you really want radical inclusion into the State of Israel?" Spencer said. "And by that I mean radical inclusion. Maybe all of the Middle East could go move in to Tel Aviv or Jerusalem. Would you really want that? "Jews exist precisely because you did not assimilate," Spencer continued, in comments Rosenberg said he viewed as bordering on anti-Semitic. "That is why Jews are a coherent people with a history and a culture and a future. It's because you had a sense of yourselves. I respect that about you. I want my people to have that same sense of themselves.""

Avinoam Bar-Yosef, the president of the Jewish People Policy Institute, has argued: “There are parts of the world that do not comprehend that Judaism is both a nation, a religion and a civilization. Now, with the rise of nationalism, it is possible that there could be greater appreciation of that.”

Indeed, some of Europe’s far-right leaders point to Israel as an example of what they would like their own countries to become. Beatrix von Storch, the AfD’s deputy leader, stated in a recent interview with the Jerusalem Report that “Israel could be a role model for Germany.” She elaborated: “Israel is a democracy that has a free and pluralistic society. Israel also makes efforts to preserve its unique culture and traditions. The same should be possible for Germany and any other nation.”

Similarly, Mischaël Modrikamen, the president of the People’s Party in Belgium, said: “There are those in Europe who look at Israel as an aberration, but there are also those who look at Israel as a model and a value.” Modrikamen is also the executive director of the Movement, an organization associated with the former Trump advisor Steve Bannon that promotes European right-wing populist parties. He makes his views clear: “Israel is the example for Europe because it is a nation-state concept that fights for its values and concentrates on the future. This is the model we want as sovereigntists. It affirms exactly what we are and where we are heading.”
SOURCE
 

Karlysymon

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@DesertRose , i have moved this here



Bonus footage on who supports immoral wars.


This pastor is far from my path but at least he is committed to the truth about who sows mayhem and corruption on the land.
When i saw that image, i couldn't help but exclaim OMG. I had to verify the statement though and its amazing how he echoes what Gore Vidal said said.
End Times Buffoonery
"Protestant fundamentalists found ample theological justification to support Euro-Atlantic elites’ drive for global hegemony. Indeed, the late American intellectual Gore Vidal whimsically observed that the practical result of this Dispensationalist theology was a “military build up that can never, ever cease until we have done battle for the Lord.”

And to me, this perfectly exposes Christian Zionism at its very core.
I was watching Focus on Israel on a Christian network and the presenter has an organisation that holds these conferences with invited speakers. This particular episode had 6 speakers, the first being John Bolton and the last was a Reverend who unequivocally stated that "what you do with your life is optional but what you do with Israel isn't optional".(Sorry, i tried to locate the video of the episode but failed)
While watching, i couldn't help but ask myself why any christian would have people like Bolton for fellow travelers. I guess that the end justifies the means and as long as Bolton is doing "God's work", what does it matter?
 

elsbet

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@DesertRose , i have moved this here


When i saw that image, i couldn't help but exclaim OMG. I had to verify the statement though and its amazing how he echoes what Gore Vidal said said.
End Times Buffoonery
"Protestant fundamentalists found ample theological justification to support Euro-Atlantic elites’ drive for global hegemony. Indeed, the late American intellectual Gore Vidal whimsically observed that the practical result of this Dispensationalist theology was a “military build up that can never, ever cease until we have done battle for the Lord.”

And to me, this perfectly exposes Christian Zionism at its very core.
I was watching Focus on Israel on a Christian network and the presenter has an organisation that holds these conferences with invited speakers. This particular episode had 6 speakers, the first being John Bolton and the last was a Reverend who unequivocally stated that "what you do with your life is optional but what you do with Israel isn't optional".(Sorry, i tried to locate the video of the episode but failed)
While watching, i couldn't help but ask myself why any christian would have people like Bolton for fellow travelers. I guess that the end justifies the means and as long as Bolton is doing "God's work", what does it matter?
"... a “military build up that can never, ever cease until we have done battle for the Lord.”

Until *WE* have done battle for the Lord? I don't think that is biblical. What the heck is that about?
 

Karlysymon

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Foreign Policy And The Establishment Of Religion
Former U.S. ambassador to Israel Daniel Kurtzer debunked Pompeo and Friedman’s assertions about the negotiating history concerning the Golan and explained the administration’s recognition decision this way: “Ideological support for Israeli territorial expansion and the courting of American Jewish and Christian Evangelical voters is now driving American foreign policy—bad foreign policy that has created problems, not solved them.”
 

TokiEl

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Ask Pompeo &Co. :)
The practical end-result/logical conclusion of Christian Zionism.....no offence.
You keep harping about Christian Zionism as if the House of Saud's man in the Wahabi House is a Christian Zionist.

No the Trump administration has done everything in their power to ignite and unite the muslim world to attack Israel.
 

Lisa

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And to me, this perfectly exposes Christian Zionism at its very core.
Maybe Christian Zionism is really about being happy the Jews are back in the land God gave them? Nothing more and nothing less? Blessing Israel instead of cursing them also comes to mind. As well as we Christians are grafted with the natural branches into the olive tree?
 
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What an informative interview, thanks! According to Pastor Chuck Baldwin, who used to believe and preach Christian Zionism for 30 years, he estimates that approximately 98% of American Protestant churches are preaching Zionism and that the Scofield Bible was created during World War I and II to implement the Zionist prophecy. Zionists think and believe that helping the anti-Christ, is helping Jesus Christ to come. It explains much.
 

Lisa

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What an informative interview, thanks! According to Pastor Chuck Baldwin, who used to believe and preach Christian Zionism for 30 years, he estimates that approximately 98% of American Protestant churches are preaching Zionism and that the Scofield Bible was created during World War I and II to implement the Zionist prophecy. Zionists think and believe that helping the anti-Christ, is helping Jesus Christ to come. It explains much.
What is preaching Zionism? God gave the land to the Jews as an everlasting covenant. Their being out of the land for years did not negate the covenant. Christians should be happy that God keeps His promises.

I don’t believe the Scofield Bible was created for that..lol! If anything it’s been credited for the pre trib rapture fallacy.

That last bit is a lie. No Christian is gonna help the antichtist...if we even knew who he was. Jesus is coming and doesn’t need our help.
 
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What is preaching Zionism? God gave the land to the Jews as an everlasting covenant. Their being out of the land for years did not negate the covenant. Christians should be happy that God keeps His promises.

I don’t believe the Scofield Bible was created for that..lol! If anything it’s been credited for the pre trib rapture fallacy.

That last bit is a lie. No Christian is gonna help the antichtist...if we even knew who he was. Jesus is coming and doesn’t need our help.
...mkay.
 

Serveto

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Maybe Christian Zionism is really about being happy the Jews are back in the land God gave them? Nothing more and nothing less? Blessing Israel instead of cursing them also comes to mind. As well as we Christians are grafted with the natural branches into the olive tree?
If Christian Zionism were as simplistic as this, as you have here put it, even if in question form, this thread would not exist. You could be picking flowers with the Shas (ultra-Orthodox) Religious Party of Israel and few people would notice.

Christian Zionism is an apocalyptic, geopolitical, endgame force, and Christian Evangelical Zionists constitute a significant voting bloc in the USA and beyond. We will continue to examine its influence on especially American foreign policy in this and related threads, and, at times, use information from other than the Bible exclusively in the process.
 
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Lisa

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If Christian Zionism were as simplistic as this, as you have here put it, even if in question form, this thread would not exist. You could be picking flowers with the Shas (ultra-Orthodox) Religious Party of Israel and few people would notice.

Christian Zionism is an apocalyptic, geopolitical, endgame force, and Christian Evangelical Zionists constitute a significant voting bloc in the USA and beyond. We will continue to examine its influence on especially American foreign policy in this and related threads, and, at times, use information from other than the Bible exclusively in the process.
Well that must be my Christian Zionism then ;)
 
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